Police Ego 101: Class Is In Session

Ever watch a simple contact spiral because someone felt disrespected? We sat down with Ofc. Jorge Lopez, a 30-year officer and veteran trainer, to unpack why ego flares so fast on the street and how to keep decisions anchored in reason, law, and outcome. Jorge doesn’t preach clichés—he maps the psychology. Using Freud’s id–ego–superego as a field-ready model, he shows how the “horse” (id) wants instant gratification, the “reins” (superego) tug toward ideals, and the “rider” (ego) has to steer under stress. When a “snake on the trail” appears—insults, defiance, a sudden kick—officers feel before they think. The trick is noticing the spike and buying time.

We break down the limbic system and amygdala’s threat signals versus the prefrontal cortex where law, policy, and judgment live. Anger is fast, fear is loud, and love—duty to protect—often proves stronger than both. George offers practical tools: the RULER method to recognize, label, and regulate emotions; the Johari Window to reveal blind spots that only emerge under heat; and his Four C’s—Camera, Communicate, Contact, Control—to structure every interaction. Add his favorite formula—Distance + Cover = Time—and you get a simple path to safer, smarter choices that hold up in court and on camera.

We also challenge the illusion of control. Crowds can’t be commanded into calm; you monitor potential threats while solving the actual problem. Talk more, force less. Competence breeds calm, and the best fighters rarely need to prove it. You’ll hear how internal scripts—It’s not personal; Don’t take the bait; Is this worth my career?—help officers steer back to thinking. And beyond tactics, we talk identity: building a life outside the badge so the job doesn’t own you.

If you’re a cop, trainer, or curious citizen, this conversation delivers actionable mindset, emotional intelligence, scenario training insights, and street-proven frameworks to reduce unnecessary force and improve outcomes. Subscribe, share this with a teammate, and leave a review with the one tool you’ll pract

Peregrine.io: Turn your worst detectives into Sherlock Holmes, head to Peregrine.io tell them Two Cops One Donut sent you or direct message me and I'll get you directly connected and skip the salesmen.

Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome, Guest Intro, And Topic
• 1:07 Why Build A Class On Ego
• 2:41 Emotional Intelligence Defined And Misunderstood
• 4:12 Freud’s Id, Ego, Superego For Cops
• 6:08 Horse And Rider Metaphor In Policing
• 8:15 Emotions Hijack Thinking: Anger, Fear, Love
• 11:05 Limbic System Vs Prefrontal Cortex
• 16:06 When Officers Double Down And Why
• 18:16 Humility, Law, And First Amendment Stops
• 20:10 Tools: RULER And Naming Emotions
• 22:06 Johari Window And Unknown Stress Reactions
• 24:09 Training Shifts: Scenarios, Four C’s, Necessary Force
• 26:12 Distance, Cover, Time And Internal Dialogue
• 28:14 Culture, Control Illusions, And Talking Over Force
• 30:04 Takeaways: Humility And Self-Control As Superpowers

Transcript

SPEAKER_06: 0:00

Disclaimer. Welcome to Two Cops One Donut Podcast. The views and opinions expressed by guests on the podcast are their own and do not necessarily reflect the views of Two Cops One Donut, its hosts or affiliates. The podcast is intended for entertainment and informational purposes only. We do not endorse any guests' opinions or actions discussed during the show. Any content provided by guests is of their own volition, and listeners are encouraged to form their own opinions. Furthermore, some content is graphic and has harsh language. All right, welcome back to Cops One Donut. I'm your host, Eric Levine. With me today is Officer George Lopez. How are you, sir? I'm doing well. Thanks. And with me as always is my co-host, the big red bearded bastard banning sweatland. What's up, buddy? What's up, brother? Oh, you know, just doing our thing. Um, we've been talking about this for a while, trying to get George lined up, talking about ego. So if you are listening to this podcast at a later time, um just know that this whole thing is going to be about police ego and how we can recognize it, how we can change and adapt when it takes over, um, and hopefully start doing some preventative maintenance for officers that seem to be very susceptible to their ego and letting emotion take over when it should be rational, logical line of thinking. Um, but enough about me. Let's get to our special guest here. George, um, as I told you, you're gonna see a lot of chat going on up and down the thing right there. So feel free to answer questions as we go. I may stop and have people, you know, just tell you the question, you answer that. Um, and for those watching and listening, we do have like a PowerPoint that we are using as a guide. So if you see us looking over, we're we're just making sure we follow the class all the way through. But I don't want to bore you with PowerPoint. And George knows this stuff inside and out. So he's just gonna, we're just gonna have like a conversation about the class. So that's how this will work. And um, yeah, but before we do that, George, I just want people to kind of get to know you. What got you down this line?

SPEAKER_01: 2:22

Um, well, I've been an officer for almost 30 years now combined. Um 27 here in Fort Worth. Uh uh more than half of that in in training. And one of the things that I've seen is uh some of the gaps in our training. And I'm I've always wanted to make things a little bit better for the people who come along behind me. And um I've been very fortunate that the department has been okay with investing some time and money into me getting some good training and sending me to various courses and certifications and whatnot and trainings so that I can put this stuff together when I bring it back. Um as far as what the ego class was, is I speaking of those training gaps, um, we talk about things like emotional control, and you're not allowed to be offended as a cop. And you have to have this professional demeanor, and you can't let things you know hit you personally, but how we don't we don't train them on how to do that, we don't test them on their ability to do that. And from the outset, um a person's character is pretty much set by the time they get to the police academy. I mean, 21, 22-year-old um man or woman is who they are by then. So as far as training goes, you're you're not gonna change their character. At the most, we can model the type of character that is the most conducive to law enforcement and most beneficial to the community, but we can't we can't remake someone's character or um demeanor or those kind of things. The best we can do other than modeling is things like this with uh with some education on it.

SPEAKER_06: 4:08

Training, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 4:09

Right.

SPEAKER_06: 4:09

Um you're gonna see this happen quite a bit too, sir. Whenever you see these green uh things pop up here, this is the people that are gifting memberships to other people watching to our YouTube channel. So Brandar86 uh just gifted five.

SPEAKER_01: 4:23

Hello, Mr. Billfold.

SPEAKER_06: 4:25

Uh and uh yeah, Mr. Billfold, he is one of our regulars. Um very good dude. Uh, but thank you very much, Brandar. Appreciate it. Um and then uh we've got um and then also you see this part right here.

SPEAKER_08: 4:41

Yes, yeah, just remember that.

SPEAKER_06: 4:43

So um, but yeah, we are going to um we're gonna jump into the ego stuff, but for you, sir, there's one thing that you and uh banning have in common that we didn't bring up yet is that you're a devil dog.

SPEAKER_01: 4:57

I am.

SPEAKER_06: 4:57

Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 4:58

So simplify.

SPEAKER_06: 4:59

Yep.

SPEAKER_01: 5:00

If banning simplify, I'm I'm lagging. I apologize, guys. Love it. Um I think I might be a little bit before his time, though. 89 to 95. Yeah, nine ninety-seven to oh one. Okay.

SPEAKER_06: 5:16

He was in the 80s, bro. Yes, dang. What was it like working with Paul Revere?

SPEAKER_01: 5:20

It wasn't bad. He, you know, he had some ego.

SPEAKER_06: 5:23

Yeah, he had some ego, yeah. Um, we got another Craig Holcomb. Oh, gifted 20 memberships, sir. He's trying to outdo Brand R86. Thank you very much, brother. We really appreciate that. Mr. Bill Fold, Semplify, he's also a Marine, yep. Um, and then uh and then going down the line here. Behave in the chat, y'all. You know, there's certain things we're not gonna chat about. We're gonna Marine's blood. Yep. Marine's blood is one of our mods.

SPEAKER_01: 5:51

Um Lopez is Hollywood. Yeah, that's okay. We had drill instructors. I know you guys had Sand Fleas, right? Oh fired. Uh I was Parasylon.

SPEAKER_06: 6:04

I was flying high. I was uh you know, San Antonio. It's pretty pretty rough. Well, I was Air Force, so don't tell.

SPEAKER_05: 6:19

I can't remember.

SPEAKER_06: 6:20

Something like that. Jeez O Pete's the memberships keep flying. Does somebody else pay or is that still the 20 going on?

SPEAKER_05: 6:27

Probably still the 20.

SPEAKER_06: 6:28

Yeah, it's probably still the 20. Jesus Pete's it's just flying through there. You know what? Marine Blood did not get an account, so cheers. We have a rule. Every time Marines Blood doesn't get a membership, we drink. So he's never gotten one. Harrison. Oh, somebody else must have. Thank you, Craig. Subs. Craig Harrison and oh, somebody see, somebody else did do one. He said Coase. Who's Coase? They all happen so fast. Oh, there it is. Yep. Lofton did it. There it is. Thank you, Lofton. Appreciate it. How do you think you say that first name there? Cose? Kosechia. I don't know. That's a hard one. I never try to pronounce that name because Lofton's so much easier. Brandart, everybody making me look cheap. Sorry, brother. All right. Let's uh let's keep let's keep this going. All right. So um Marine, um, been in law enforcement almost 30 years. Um a huge chunk of that has been training, which is how you and I met. Um basically taught me everything I know about instructing people, y'all.

SPEAKER_01: 7:42

So uh don't blame me for that.

SPEAKER_06: 7:44

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01: 7:46

That's where I keep screwing up.

SPEAKER_06: 7:47

But um, no, uh let's get to let's get to this because I don't know how long this class is gonna take us. Okay. Sure. But uh I want to jump into this. Uh what was the problem and the gap that you noticed and how did this come about?

SPEAKER_01: 8:01

All right. So the gap that I noticed, um, partly uh a lot of the videos that you've posted and a lot of officers having just emotional responses to interactions with the public. And in in my opinion, those kind of things could influence how that interaction ends or how it goes or how it progresses. So uh everyone is on this big kick of de-escalation and everyone wants us to get along with everybody, and you know, and and that's that's absolutely part of it. That that has to you have to have a good character, you have to be a professional, and all of those things. However, you are still just a human being. And as a human being, you're susceptible to all the things that all human beings are susceptible to. So human factors across the board, performance-rise, this is something performance-wise, this is something I've I've really dug deep into as far as response times and the way your eye works and your brain processing and all that stuff. But what I've noticed was is that we don't have a whole lot of um emotional intelligence training. We mention it and we talk about how we need to be in control of our emotions and we need to not get upset with things, but how exactly do we do that?

SPEAKER_06: 9:19

And and I'm gonna cut you off real quick. When we're talking about emotional intelligence, a lot of people think of that as I can read you emotionally, I can tell how you feel. But really, what emotional intelligence is is reading yourself.

SPEAKER_01: 9:31

Right. There there's four major components there's self-awareness, social awareness, others' awareness, and internal awareness. All of those components um factor into your emotional intelligence. So it is a part of being able to pick up on other people's emotions. Maybe reading a room and or um an interaction. I can I can if I have good emotional intelligence, I can kind of tell from your demeanor where my conversation might be leading you. Or that I said one thing that just kind of just kind of got to you. So with those things in mind, um, we don't have a whole lot of training on that. So this is really like I showed you earlier, I showed you a magic trick and this little cheesy, sad little sleight of hand trick.

SPEAKER_06: 10:16

It was cool, guys.

SPEAKER_01: 10:16

It was I tried to get him to show it on here, and he's like, I can't. It's it's nothing more than sleight of hand, a little bit of distraction. But when I showed it to him, he he was amazed. He was like, Oh, that's really cool. How'd you do that? But then when I explained it to him, I gave him a glimpse behind the curtain. Uh, I can't won't be able to fool him with that kind of trick again. And that's kind of the whole concept here is that once you're aware that you are having certain emotions or reactions to one thing or another, um, you can be aware of them, you can be on guard for them. And the reason I titled this class Ego is because a lot of people um, in layman's terms, believe that if you are arrogant, if you're self-centered, if you have problems communicating with people, you get upset easily, you're easily offended, you have a big ego, and your ego has been uh damaged or attacked or offended. And that's that's kind of a misnomer. We get into that in the class a little bit, but the the the truth of it is is whatever you call it, it's a human response. And if officers, young officers, recruits, even senior officers, um having some recognition of that is just gonna be helpful.

SPEAKER_06: 14:22

Yeah. Um, sorry, we're having some connection issues with Banning. He may have to jump off here and come back on. Um, shout out to Jerry. Uh hooked us up with 20 bucks and said, Welcome, George. Thank you, sir. So thank you very much. Uh I don't uh know who else. Okay, that's my mom. She said thank you for that. Uh trying to get a lot of people to comprehend that is nearly impossible. Um but yeah, I want to thank Jerry very much. And then uh, okay, so you noticed the gap and you recognized what needed to be um done. So now you've got the challenge of a person that let's face it, in law enforcement, I have never heard of a class that discusses ego, right? Talks about how what it is, how we go after it, how we make sure we avoid it, how to recognize the signs of it. So you had the painstaking task of figuring all that out from scratch. Right. Um so you you go through, you study, you pull up a bunch of scholarly stuff that because when we teach the stuff, it isn't just some dude saying, hey, this, that, and the other. You had to back up what you were saying.

SPEAKER_04: 15:27

Right.

SPEAKER_06: 15:28

So when when we train and when we create classes um through T call regulations and stuff like that, like that's one of the things you do is I'm not just teaching you based on my experience. I'm teaching I'm teaching you based on things that I can back up through sources. Right. So you create this course. And so from there, let's is there anything else that you want to chime into that before we uh no, that's that's a good segue. Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 15:54

Um so to start with, we we we talked about ego and ego being kind of the I don't want to call it a misnomer because it does, it does play in. It's just not um it's not the end-all be-all way to phrase or to think, even think about this. So what I do and what I did with my research is I went straight to the sources with psychology and uh personality traits and whatnot. The guy there is uh some guy named Sigmund Freud. Yeah, yeah. Some about your, you know, my mom, your mom, whatever, somebody's mom. Um and he identifies three components of your personality, which he says are across the board, very basic, very foundational, but that everybody has. And uh, of course, I have you have pulled up on that PowerPoint, per those T cole, like you mentioned, they they have to have lesson objectives. So the class is is gotta be as legitimate as possible for um for it to just even stand alone. I can't just throw stuff up there and say, you know, this is this is what we think. Right. And this is this is the kind of copy it should be. I I have to back it. And you know, on a personal note, um, I want it to be good. I don't, if if there's something horrible and something wrong and it's totally off base, I I need to know about that so I can correct it because I don't want to send out bad information. So anyway, I started with the scientific stuff with the basics of that psychology theory, um, the characteristics of self-discipline um per our general orders and how it relates to the importance of how you have to develop that emotional control. And then a couple of tools uh that I I found online um and through some some more research. My my big go-to is for science.

unknown: 17:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 17:38

If if you've ever done any force science stuff, man, that's a real look behind the curtain.

SPEAKER_06: 17:42

We've had Von Klem on here a few times.

SPEAKER_01: 17:44

Amazing. I've been his student several times. Dude, just I film notebooks just listening to the guys. Yeah. So anyway, uh, a couple of principles in something called the Johari window. It sounds exotic, but it's actually just a combination of the guys' names.

SPEAKER_10: 17:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 18:00

And um the ruler concept that I recently stumbled upon that makes a whole lot of sense that I'm gonna start incorporating with um on the spot detection of when I can feel myself going sideways in an interaction. And we'll talk about that too.

SPEAKER_06: 18:17

Okay. Cool. Um, looking at some of the comments, Mr. Billfold, uh, Sprite as always, he said, There are no classes because LEO culture would never stoop solo as to admit flaws unless they can get qualified immunity. Uh, which is one of the things I like about where we're at. We have no issues talking about our flaws, um, but we're really good at creating courses and and trying to rectify the issues that we find.

SPEAKER_01: 18:43

Um so just to address that, um, we got to start somewhere.

SPEAKER_10: 18:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 18:48

I mean, uh it it might not be as timely as everyone would like it to be, but at least it's being noticed and those gaps are being filled and people are taking steps. So watch banging on the table, by the way.

SPEAKER_06: 18:59

I can hear it through the mic. Yeah. You're good. I know you're you're you're handing it animated. Talk up here. Yeah. Trying to take the Italian out of him. Um, looks like Banning's back. Let's bring his third time's a charm, hey.

SPEAKER_05: 19:18

That's right.

SPEAKER_06: 19:19

Oh, geez, I gotta turn you down. You're super loud in my ears, brother. There we go. Um, all right, going over to the chat here. USA Transparency said, Hey, I got a free month membership. Sweet, thanks. Appreciate that. Uh all right, so all right, brother. So we got the objectives out of the way, and uh let's uh let's jump in.

SPEAKER_01: 19:43

Okay, so the according to Freud, his personality theory breaks our personality characteristics, our basic psychology into three big components: the id, the ego, and the superego. Everyone is born um with the capacity to develop all three. Everyone, I would say, um has an id. And the id is that toddler, that your inner child. I want what I want when I want it. And it's the your desires and they sexual desires, material desires, desire for respect, desire for acceptance, all of those come to the id. Um, if you can think about it, uh in terms of a child, the way we learn to interact in our world is basically through trial and error from the beginning. So as an infant, you recognize that you're wet, you're cold, you're tired, you're hungry, something hurts. And the only thing that you can do to communicate that to the outside world is to cry. And once that crying is initiated, you get that response. The adult comes to check on you, figure out what's going on. If what your problem is, is that you've got a wet diaper and they give you a bottle, the crying continues because that need isn't met. So it is basically your needs, and and they need to be met. And they can be rational or irrational. Um, they're unconscious, um, they demand immediate gratification. For example, the infant crying. And um in that sense, it's not acceptable for us as adults, especially as law enforcement professionals, to operate in our id. Okay, I can't I can't look at the guy and say you're under arrest, turn around, put your hands behind your back. And when he doesn't comply immediately, it's not appropriate to just thump him on the head and get to work and get him handcuffed. Okay, that's my id. I want to end it fast. I want to do it now. Or I want to do it in the way that I believe reflects the respect I believe I deserve. And that's another part of it we'll get into after that. But that's your id. Basically, your inner child, you want your demands, your needs, all of that stuff. Your superego is the other end of that spectrum. So your superego is built on uh the guidelines that you have, depending on your culture, your upbringing, your moral values, moral compass, your parents, the way you're raised. It's basically your conscience and your ego ideal. It's um what you consider internally to be right or wrong.

unknown: 22:20

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 22:21

That's that would be your super ego. And your superego is always wanting to do what you've been taught is the ideal to do. Um rules and behaviors that the ego aspires to. It tries to keep us civilized, it's it tries to suppress the id's urges in in the sense that um your id wants to do a, but your superego recognizes that B is more appropriate and A is totally inappropriate. So there's there's conversation there between the superego and the id, if you would.

SPEAKER_06: 22:53

Yeah. Uh Mr. Billfold says they need id and need us not to know the law any better than they do, even though even though they dang it, it shifted.

SPEAKER_01: 23:06

Even though they get that sweet taxpayer money direct deposit with no clue how to do their job.

SPEAKER_08: 23:11

Yeah. Id is a hell of a drug, light control.

SPEAKER_01: 23:14

Um yeah, you're not wrong. I mean, id is it absolutely is, but that's not the question, uh, because your id is is just as uh important to you and your needs and your your desire to have those needs met as mine is. The trick is is to recognize when my id is getting outside of reasonableness so that I can get it back under control. And that's on the next slide, that's where the ego comes in. Gotcha. So the ego is like the balancer of the superego and the id. So when a lot of people say he's got a big ego or he's got a strong ego, or his his ego is too big for you know his authority, he's got a bad ego problem. Um, what they're really trying to say is that he's not emotionally regulated. He's not keeping a close hold and control over the id using the super ego's guidance and the ego's balance.

SPEAKER_06: 24:11

You find it a coincidence that the thing that we crave the most as a cop is ID, which is spelt the same way as id. Yeah. Give me your ID. Give me your id. Give me your id. Yeah. My id needs to be satisfied. Yeah. That's what Mr.

SPEAKER_05: 24:25

Bill Fold's talking about is ID crackable.

SPEAKER_06: 24:27

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hello. Okay. He goes, I meant ID, like demanding. Oh, yeah, that's probably what made my brain trigger that. Yeah, that's hilarious. Uh good job, Mr. Bill Fold. You're on top of shit. Good catch. I love it.

SPEAKER_01: 24:41

That's why I love having them on here. Uh so anyway, back to ego. So the ego works to keep the id's impulses acceptable and it operates on what we perceive to be the reality. Everything that there's there's perception, and then there's um stimulus. We'll call it stimulus or data. Okay. Your eye will pick up data, your eye will see something. And the only thing that your eye is really doing is it's detecting changes in how that light is reflecting off of whatever object in space you are seeing. It takes time for that data to get to your brain, and it takes time for your brain to assess what that is and assign meaning to it. And once that meaning is assigned to it, that's when it goes through this process of value sorting. It's either important or unimportant, or it's offensive or not offensive to my id or my desires or my superego or my ego. So that's how we're constantly filtering every interaction with things. And um, it takes time. And part of the part of the explanation, if if it helps you to understand, is a great example that comes up in the next couple of slides here. Um, the ego is often compared to being a judge. So you've got your superego, which is everything moralistic, perfect, ideal. You know, dad and mom would be proud of you for behaving this way, and your id is your inner child wanting what it wants when it wants it. So the ego has to balance the two because you can't operate on superego because your your ego knows that your id will never be satisfied. And if it's basically a negotiator to try and buy time to satisfy the id's desires. Gotcha. Okay. And the only way we can interrupt that process in the middle of things is to recognize it when it's happening and be a stronger ego negotiator.

SPEAKER_06: 26:36

Yeah. Um, Brandar86 said the I picks up information. The problem with information, it can mean nothing or everything. And bias creates an interpretation one way or another, can cause problems. 100%.

SPEAKER_01: 26:49

Yep. That's that's not wrong. And a bias can can there's a negative connotation to it, but it can also be a positive bias. It could be uh the kind of bias that leads you to do something positive instead of doing something in the negative. So it everyone has those. And um, like I said, assigning meaning to it is is the trick.

SPEAKER_06: 27:12

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. All right. So we're on to uh do we need to really read?

SPEAKER_01: 27:20

Um no, no, we don't need the geo. Yeah, I was gonna say general order just explains it. It's we we are bound to at least make this attempt to be emotionally regulated in dealing with the comp with the community.

SPEAKER_06: 27:32

Gotcha. Um, we just got another 10 memberships gifted by Lofton again. Dang, appreciate it. Just looking through who got some memberships. I'm not seeing any names. Uh Wichita Audits got one. Uh, in Bing Bong, 25987 got one. Good for you, buddy. Um Marine Bloods. Eric, is there slides? It sounded like George mentioned you. Yes, we're we're reading the slides. We have them on the screen up here, but we don't want to bore you guys with looking at the slides. Um, PowerPoint's a killer of it.

SPEAKER_01: 28:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 28:07

Stay on track. I was gonna say, because he's taught it so many times. We can have a conversation versus reading from the slides. So we are actually having a conversation about what the slides entail. So um Freeman Key, 75 memberships, Marine Blood, and I get none. Oh, damn. Sorry, brother. Uh Brandard drink. Yeah, cheers. Yep. Okay. So now we will, I think we're on to our first video.

SPEAKER_01: 28:35

So this uh we got oh so the example. So the the the example that uh we use, you can go to the next one with the horses.

SPEAKER_08: 28:43

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 28:43

So if you think of um id, ego and superego and how they operate in your mind, um, a very basic way to understand that the concept of how they operate with each other is to imagine the metaphor of a horse and rider. So the horse would be the powerful urges of the id. The id is going to get what it wants. Okay, the horse uh weighs what, 1200, 1300 pounds.

SPEAKER_06: 29:06

About as much as banning.

SPEAKER_01: 29:07

Yeah. So and the man on top weighs much, much less. However, if the man on top is an experienced rider who can use the reins properly, he can control that horse and he can get that horse to go where it wants it to go and keep that horse going in a direction. Horses can be a valuable tool for work. But you have to satisfy their id. But you have to be able to negotiate that id with that horse. So the metaphor is the horse is your id, the rider is your ego, and the reins are your super ego.

SPEAKER_08: 29:37

Ah, that makes sense.

SPEAKER_01: 29:38

So when you pull one way or the other with the superego, if you get too strong a response on to the right on a horse, and that id does not want to go to the right, you're gonna have conflict with that id, and that id will rebel. So you can see how it's a balancing act for the ego to be a good rider.

SPEAKER_09: 29:55

Ah, gotcha.

SPEAKER_05: 29:56

It's almost like balancing out TRT, too, if you do it wrong.

unknown: 30:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 30:02

You just rage out. Yeah. Uh that's funny. Um Mr. Billfold said, I fail to see any sense of that obligation to control emotions by Elios. I guess most cops missed out on the obligation part while getting fitted for their gun belt. I I guess it just depends on the situation, sir. Um, I'm not gonna just put a blanket statement on everybody like that. So um, all right. Let's go on to the next, which is a video. So we will share that screen. Let me, I think we're on the right one. Going in with the horse talk. That's the right video, correct? Yeah. Okay, so we'll share this screen.

SPEAKER_01: 30:45

We will So can we talk while we're over this and kind of explain what's going on? Um, do I need to do I need to play sound with it? No, you don't have to. It's pretty clear what's happening.

SPEAKER_06: 30:57

Okay, I'll mute it and then you can talk over it.

SPEAKER_01: 31:00

Okay, so you've got the id. Id wants to do its thing, and the rider is trying to control it. So with that super ego, he's trying to over-control it with that whip. Or uh I I don't know what they call it. A whip. It's a horse whip, yeah. Yeah. So in competition here, these horses are very highly trained and they're very, very good at what they do. It's just that for whatever reason, today, that horse didn't want to do that thing that the rider needed it to do. So the rider, the ego with emotional deregulation, didn't handle that well. So what he did was he he tried to forcibly delay the horse's gratification. And then at the end, if you see it, the horse does what it wants anyway and just runs right through the barricade.

SPEAKER_10: 31:42

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 31:43

So when you try to overcorrect with that super ego moralistic, idealistic, perfect moral compass response, and the ego isn't there to balance it well, it can be detrimental.

SPEAKER_08: 31:55

Gotcha. Okay. And I I don't know.

SPEAKER_05: 31:58

Just to add to that, on a canine front, I ran a canine for many years. And you know, they they taught us from day one when we were training our dogs, and and some of this came from uh the area that you work at from one of the trainers, you know, you have to and this is just the terminology, but urinate, hydrate, and defecate. If you're not doing that consistently, it's an animal, it's a breathing heartbeat. If you're not doing that, and that's on the top of their brain, if you're giving them instruction and you haven't done the urinate hydrate and defecate, it's gonna be a major issue. So I mean it's it's encapsulating that as well. I mean, if you're not if you're not taking care of them checking all of that stuff uh before you deploy, you you may have an issue for sure.

SPEAKER_07: 32:41

Yeah. Um all right. Let's go to this video.

SPEAKER_01: 32:46

So this quick one, you see, um, this is a horse training video, and the guy is talking about this horse that's got some damage, some psychological damage. It was abused and it was treated. Poorly, and he's trying to get it to trust him and whatnot. Um as it relates to the id, the ego, and the superego, this horse. Um when you see here at the end, it's a little bit longer. Maybe you could move it a little bit forward to where the horse is laying down. Um there we go, right there. So this horse is docile, it doesn't want any trouble. But his id lashes out here, and you'll see in a second. For no reason. No reason other than what's known to the horse. And I don't, you know, presume to know what a horse might be thinking. I don't have that much experience with him. Yeah. But what the trainer is doing there is doing something that in the past aggravated the horse. Yeah. And now if you watch the horse's reaction, right after he bites, he lets him go and he moves and he goes right back to looking at his trainer like I recognize that I did something wrong. I I I don't know why I did that. And that happens to us as well.

SPEAKER_08: 33:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 33:52

Uh lots of times, I don't know. I can speak for myself when I say I have been in my life so angry in a situation or an interaction or whatever, that I do or say something that I number one immediately regret, and then two, afterwards can't explain why.

SPEAKER_10: 34:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 34:09

And that and that's a human thing. That's not a just cops thing.

SPEAKER_10: 34:15

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 34:15

All humans do that. I mean, if if you if you take a look at how we interact with people that are not in law enforcement, look at all the videos of people losing it because their McDonald's order was wrong.

SPEAKER_10: 34:25

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 34:26

And hopping over the counter and doing something. That's the id that got ticked off, and the ego is not managing the superego. The superego clearly should be saying something like, hey, it's not reasonable for you to lose it like this. But they'd lose it anyway. And then afterwards, it becomes kind of hard to explain. So that that's kind of a human thing across the board.

SPEAKER_06: 34:43

And it goes back to your magic trick analogy that it's happening to these adults that are in their 30s because nobody's shown them the magic trick and how it works yet. Right.

SPEAKER_01: 34:54

Right. And a lot of emotional regulation is well, it'll we'll get it at the end when we talk about self-discipline.

SPEAKER_09: 35:01

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 35:03

So a strong ego isn't a bad thing. When someone says they have a strong ego, strong ego is a disciplined rider. Okay. A strong ego manages the moral ideals of the superego with the impulsive, instinctive nature of the id. So if we can get that ego to recognize when there's problems, then we're better off. And the metaphor I use for that is going back to the horse. So that horse is your id, and you're the rider, and you've got your reins for the super ego, and you're riding along this trail, and everything is great. The horse loves it. You're having fun, it's out in nature, no problems. Okay. And you're in charge. That horse recognizes the riders in charge. He's following the leads on the reins. Everything is great. But then all of a sudden, the horse sees a snake on the trail. Who now is in charge of that horse? Right. That horse is in charge of that horse. Yeah. So the trick is for us to see the signs that there are snakes on the trail so that we can guide either off the trail or keep the horse controlled or rein the horse back and keep them away from the snake completely.

SPEAKER_06: 36:05

Altogether. Yeah. That makes sense. Like it. Marine blood, Tim, get in here. Rub your ears and say, woo-sah.

SPEAKER_01: 36:15

All right. So next up is emotion. Emotion. Okay, so emotion is the big thing. Everyone and every in every situation is going to have an emotional component to every human interaction. Just about everything that we do is flavored or filtered through our emotions. Think something as simple as loading the dishwasher.

unknown: 36:39

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 36:39

You are loading the dishwasher. Dinner was awesome. It was great. Candlelight dinner, anniversary. Everything's beautiful. Your wife, lovely bride, everything is perfect. And you go to load the dishwasher and you put a cup on the bottom rack. And you look over and your wife and she goes, that cup goes on the top rack. Yeah. In an instant, everything that built up to that moment emotionally gets sidetracked and bypassed and hijacked by the emotion of here I am trying to do something nice after dinner. And this is the respect I get. This is I get criticized.

SPEAKER_06: 37:19

So for a cop, that's you know, I I came out here to help to try to do something good for the community, and you're giving me shit, Mr. Billfold.

SPEAKER_01: 37:28

It could be anything as it could be as simple as, hey man, how are you doing tonight? Man, screw you, cop. Okay, cool. I mean, you've you've been a cop almost 30 years, you're like, okay, all right, I'll see you later. Hope your day gets better. But if you're a young officer who, you know, doesn't have that level of maturity yet, or you've never been taught that something like that might happen as a law enforcement officer, you'll react emotionally. And that's that's pretty much across the board human. Okay, because for as many um videos as you we have of cops behaving badly, there's just as many of civilians behaving badly.

unknown: 38:05

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 38:05

Black Friday is a great example.

unknown: 38:07

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 38:08

Tickle me Elmo, that's all I remember. Yeah. So I'm and that's not it's not restricted to law enforcement. It's not a law enforcement psychology. I wouldn't even call it a law enforcement culture. It's a human performance factor that we have to we have to negotiate our emotions.

SPEAKER_06: 38:27

Yeah. I like that. So it's not it's not that just only us would benefit from learning this stuff. It's society in a whole. Sure.

SPEAKER_01: 38:36

Yeah, if if everybody was better at emotional regulation, it would be a better place. Right.

unknown: 38:40

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 38:41

So we talk about emotions and how strong those emotions can be. And I talk with a little bit, we don't go too much into it, but we we address it. Um, the strongest emotions, and a lot of people say the strongest emotion is going to be anger, the strongest emotion is going to be fear. And for the most part, they're very close to being right, in my opinion. Um my opinion being just based on what I have personally experienced and what I can attribute in my life as a law enforcement officer and just as husband, father, all of those things and interacting with people. Um anger is very, very fast. We feel anger very, very quickly when we don't have a met expectation. Um, we go we can go very quickly into a blind rage. It's it's it's crazy fast how quickly we get angry. Um, it's very dangerous for cops to have to negotiate with anger. Um fear is another. It's it's a very primitive emotion. Uh big scary thing wants to eat me, run away, fight, set it on fire, something. Right. So I don't know what to do, and I'm scared. I might even just freeze. And I'm gonna do what makes the most sense in that little second, um, which could be just about anything in in in the throes of that emotion because it's very powerful. It's unavoidable in law enforcement because our job is scary stuff.

SPEAKER_06: 40:11

Yeah, he says Sebulous Max was saying George is talking about my wife with the quick anger.

SPEAKER_01: 40:17

That's a great example of dishwasher. Yeah, you load it wrong, you're in trouble. But fear is one of those things that we have to learn how to negotiate. And uh, I think it was John Wayne that said, you know, courage isn't not being afraid, it's it's mounting up even when you are afraid. You know, we have that's the job we swore to do. Yeah, and that goes back to being a character-driven culture. We should be hiring people of great high moral character that have that deep internal need or id to serve their fellow man. Yeah, okay. Otherwise, um fear is gonna dominate, anger is gonna creep in very easily.

SPEAKER_06: 40:55

How do you how do you equate for that though in the hiring process? Um I don't think we currently we we really don't.

SPEAKER_01: 41:04

That's a whole separate thing.

SPEAKER_06: 41:05

Yeah, I know, but that's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_01: 41:06

We don't really have a good way to get that. We have psyche valves, we have interviews, and what we lose in the process, I think, is the people that are conducting the interviews and the people that are meeting these people have an internal, uh, hopefully emotional awareness, emotional intelligence of their own, yeah, and can get a good read on that person. Like you and I know from experience that the the CTPT instructors know those recruits. I mean, we're with them every day for the seven months that they're turning into cops.

SPEAKER_06: 41:39

And I would say, and you tell me, because you've done it a lot longer than me, but I could tell you just from my own experience, within the first day, I have what I consider a good read on the ones that have a high likelihood of passing and the high likelihood of failing out or getting fired.

SPEAKER_01: 41:55

Right. Or you can at least detect something that is outstandingly different about that one compared to the baseline of the rest of them.

SPEAKER_07: 42:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 42:05

And and it's not so much that you can see precisely into their personality, but you can see that something is either higher or lower than the baseline. So the strongest emotion, my opinion, um, is love. And I I come to that conclusion because love is a complex emotion that is hard to nail down. You can't really explain what it is. But there have been times that I have been so angry, but love has won through. And love has been able to tamp down that that anger. And there have been times that I've been so afraid, but love pushes me forward into doing what I what what I'm deathly afraid of. Um, if you think about it, that would be the ideal emotion for cops to experience. And I don't mean, you know, I say that, you know, almost 30-year cop, CTPT, you know, George Lopez. I'm human punching bag here, right? Yeah. And everybody thinks, oh, George thinks love is the most important emotion. It's not the touchy-feely love I'm talking about. It's not romantic love. What I'm talking about is is the love that um an officer has to stand in front of a complete stranger when shots are ringing out during the middle of a protest and telling that person to get down, get behind cover, dragging someone out of a burning building, all kinds of things. And love will make you do some crazy stuff that you can never explain later, just like anger and fear can.

SPEAKER_06: 43:26

Yeah. Um going over to the comments, um Mr. Bill Fold said the worst part for me are the veterans who join the force and forget what the Constitution their brothers and sisters died defending is all about. Um Perry Lemmley said, those of us who are willing to run into the fire, these are who we need in law enforcement. Um Chris Garrett said quality versus quantity. The Angry Vet, he's been a newer one that's been joining us. I love everything he's usually got to say on there. Um he said evals and interviews mean nothing when the target. Where'd it go? When the target IQ is subpar. Now, I will address that a little bit, Angry Vet. That did happen at um uh a department that was a very famous uh issue with that one department. But I can promise you, in my experience for the hiring, they want if they if they're gonna pick you if you got a degree over somebody that doesn't have a degree. If you've got um time in the military versus somebody that doesn't have time in the military, they're looking for that sort of thing, not IQ. We didn't even take an IQ test. Nope.

SPEAKER_01: 44:30

I don't remember one. No, I didn't take an IT.

SPEAKER_06: 44:33

Yeah. So um are there some departments I think that did do that? I know there's, like I said, there was one department, I think up in Massachusetts or Connecticut or something like that, uh, that did have something to do with trying to find high IQ. No, they had somebody that they said scored too high of an IQ. It was really strange. That's um yeah. Uh and I do know what he's talking about, but for the most part, no. Oh, we got Jerry Worms in the house. Do you know who Jerry Worms is? He was the first cop ever featured on cops. Oh, wow. Yeah, yeah. And uh carried nunchucks. He called them foldable batons. So Jerry said uh during the interview process by a psychologist, some of the way a recruit reacts to a situation cannot be duplicated only during a real incident.

SPEAKER_01: 45:20

100%. That is true. You're you're right on the mark. And that's why just to kind of not chase the rabbit too much, but just get into why as a training institution we've moved a lot towards scenario training. Scenario training has been shown to develop um schemas in the brain and what I call files that a recruit or a young officer can refer back to. So the more exposure we can get them to various files, the better their experience is gonna be. Uh, and then we have to do the stress inoculation thing because you know, we we we really can't predict what's gonna happen in real-world environments. So you're exactly right.

SPEAKER_06: 46:01

Okay. Banning, I just want to make sure you I feel like you're you're just along for the show, baby.

SPEAKER_05: 46:07

I've taken this all in, experienced a lot of it, and uh new and young people alike. So I love that we're talking about it.

SPEAKER_06: 46:14

Fair. Okay. Um, so lead us into this next one here. I will uh Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 46:21

Here's a quick little video of an officer who um I don't know all the details of the purpose for the stop. So any any probable cause, reasonable suspicion questions, I'm not really a hundred percent sure. Um, but the the problem is is that he clearly goes from trying to act as a professional to having a clear emotional response.

SPEAKER_09: 46:41

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 46:41

So it's basically to the person he's talking to knowing his rights and and standing up for his rights.

SPEAKER_06: 46:47

Um yeah, I I think we've actually covered this video on here before, but uh Mr. Billfold, yeah, this video is an oldie but a goodie. Yeah, so if you haven't seen this one, you're in for a treat. Uh all right.

SPEAKER_13: 47:01

Hi, what's going on?

SPEAKER_12: 47:05

We didn't call you.

unknown: 47:06

I don't answer questions.

SPEAKER_12: 47:08

He did. Okay, we'll go talk to him.

unknown: 47:10

Oh, I'm gonna be talking.

SPEAKER_12: 47:11

No, you're not gonna talk to me.

unknown: 47:12

Yeah, you ain't gonna talk.

SPEAKER_01: 47:14

So right there, his id is taking over. So you're gonna talk to me. I'm the guy in charge here. Uh I I am the police officer. I have the badge, I have this training, I have this authority. You will respect me at such and such level, or uh we're gonna have conflict. So if that that id need isn't met, that emotional response just starts to grow.

SPEAKER_09: 47:40

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 47:41

Keep going.

SPEAKER_12: 47:42

So go talk to the guy that called you. Isn't that in that procedure? When a complaint party calls, you go talk to the complaining party. No, you don't get sure it is. Sure it is. Sure it is. Go talk to him, he'll tell you what's going on, and then you can be like, oh, nothing illegal is going on. I can go back to doing my real job. Don't touch our vehicle. You are you are our vehicle. Don't touch our vehicle. You didn't pull us over. Yes, I did not.

SPEAKER_11: 48:11

Say what's up to Utica Police Sergeant Greg Morabito.

SPEAKER_12: 48:14

We were parked here.

SPEAKER_11: 48:15

Okay. You didn't pull it up.

SPEAKER_01: 48:17

So so if you've seen this video before and you've you've broken down before, it's really no point in going through it again. Okay, cool. The the the teaching point here that I use for the recruits and for officers is that the this officer has clearly overstepped and is now trying to force it.

SPEAKER_06: 48:33

What we call doubling down.

SPEAKER_01: 48:34

Yeah. Yeah. Instead of admitting saying, you know what, you're right. Let me go talk to that guy first. I'll be right back. Thank you. I mean, but and that that takes some emotional control, some emotional regulation because you've got to rein in that id because the id wants the respect that it believes it deserves.

SPEAKER_09: 48:49

Right. Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 48:51

So this next slide, there's just a quick little diagram just to explain it to you. Um it's a diagram of the brain and how emotions are controlled by the limbic system. Limbic system being the primitive part of the brain, the first part of the brain that develops. It uh deals with um all of your unconscious, unregulated stuff.

SPEAKER_08: 49:09

Gotcha. I'll actually show this one on the screen.

unknown: 49:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 49:13

So your emotions, your behaviors, motivations, memories, autonomic nervous system, breathing, you know, pooping, puking when you need to, all that stuff. Um and then that amygdala there, that is basically the gatekeeper of conflict or no conflict, threat or no threat, um, harmful or not harmful. So that amygdala is very important to cops because if we don't learn to regulate that, everything can become a threat. And uh you and I know from training that we'll have recruits going through a scenario with a primary purpose of the scenario, and then other members or other role players just being loud and distracting, and they almost always focus on the loud and distracting.

SPEAKER_07: 49:59

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 49:59

Because they can't circumvent that amygdala telling them that the bigger crowd is the bigger threat. When in reality, what they have in front of them is what they should be focusing on. So that's the limbic system, it's part of the brain. The uh next slide. Okay. Is that uh prefrontal cortex? That's where all of your high reasoning comes from. Okay, math, right here, science. Yes, yes. And there's studies now that show that it does not develop in adult humans in males until around the age of 25. I think females are around 22. They're a little bit quicker than us, but I think it's because from the outset, girls culturally, whatever you want to call it, they're they're a little bit better equipped with dealing with their emotions verbally than we are.

SPEAKER_07: 50:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 50:53

They can say that hurts my feelings. Whereas we don't run around saying, hey, you really hurt my feelings the other day, Eric.

SPEAKER_06: 50:59

Yeah. Well, banning does, but you know, yeah. Banning's not he's not, he's not too. Um the angry vet said, Well, I just stopped by to kick kick the algorithm. Much love, guys. If anyone can convince me that there are good cops out there, it will be y'all, I'm sure. Tough road, though. Thanks, man. Appreciate it. We're trying, brother. One step at a time. Yeah. At least we're doing something. Yeah. So we're trying to do something. Um the Lofton said, the angry vet, we cops will learn to be better from Eric and Banning. Oh, I appreciate that. And now George. Hey, thanks. Um, Mr. Billfold said, Angry vet. Angry, they are good guys, but good cops is still a hard idea to wrap my head around. It's 2025 and shit has not improved. We're trying, brother. We're trying. I promise we are trying. Um, at least you have cops that are publicly trying to acknowledge the fault and fix things. Yep. We may not get it right, but damn it, it's better than doing nothing and sitting by quiet. So, um, but yeah, prefrontal cortex, let's move on to the next here. So I use this. Oh shit.

SPEAKER_01: 52:03

It's just a quick little slide and it it's it's pretty metaphorical, but I say to them when you are emotionally unregulated or you are having an emotional response, you are literally not in your right mind. Simply because, you know, when you tell someone you're out of your mind, um it's it's impactful. You're not thinking straight. There's something wrong with how you're processing information right now. But if you're emotional and you're not regulating that emotional, that emotion well, you're literally in that limbic system and not in your prefrontal cortex. And as a law enforcement officer, you've you've got to strive to stay in that prefrontal cortex because the decisions you make in hundredths of a second can determine an outcome.

SPEAKER_06: 52:44

Right. Um I correct me if I'm wrong, prefrontal cortex doesn't make decisions nearly as quick. I'm sorry, I didn't catch, I was half reading. Oh, yeah. Um the the prefrontal cortex uh is not nearly as quick at distinguishing and in in making decisions quickly. Right. Um, so that's why it's it's a balancing act in the police world because we may have to switch over to that lizard brain really fucking quick.

SPEAKER_01: 53:10

Right. You'll feel faster than you'll think. You'll it'll always be that way. Right. And at best, you can think in a way that gets you close enough to appropriate, which is why reasonableness is so important.

SPEAKER_07: 53:23

Right.

SPEAKER_06: 53:24

Sorry, I am refilling my drink here.

SPEAKER_08: 53:26

Let me hook me up if you can.

SPEAKER_06: 53:29

Grab yourself an ice cube out of here. I didn't want to. I know you're marine and you don't give a shit. Um shit. I'll let you uh finish off this guy.

SPEAKER_05: 53:42

He doesn't care if your skinners has been all over it, man.

SPEAKER_06: 53:45

I'll let you finish that part of the bottle. I will go over here to some smoke wagon. Which one? It's gone. I I put the rest in there. Yeah, you get the rest. Thank you. Put a little smoke wagon in the bottle. There we go. Okay. Now that we're properly uh refueled.

SPEAKER_01: 54:02

Um there's a comment on there, Michelle Ferlisi. 29 years, plain clothes, undercover. I was trained and taught by older guys who fought in Vietnam. Uh, and they taught me how to focus on that one person or task and to just tune everything around you out. That's um that's not bad for some situations. Yeah. That's not bad for a gunfight. That's not bad for, I would even say, a fist fight to get someone under control. However, uh, there's this concept that we have of multitasking, and the way the brain works is we we simply can't multitask. Well, we can't watch several different things at the same time. What we can get pretty good at is changing focus very, very quickly. So I can go from you to him to him to you to this to that, the crowd, everything else. But I I still do have to have a primary focus. So it is critical to be able to do that. But um, if it's just that and we focus on that, we lose context. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 54:58

One of the things that I learned through grappling is and I never really had a reason to make this conversation until you just brought that up. But one of the things that I've learned through grappling is I can literally think in two different brains when I'm when I'm holding on to somebody on the ground, like in the areas that you and I used to work, um, I would be in a fight. Now, to me, I'm not fighting because they have no idea what they're doing on the ground. Um, so I'm controlling them, but I'm looking at everything around me because I don't need to focus on him. That muscle memory, I'm not, like I said, I'm not thinking my body's just reacting to whatever they're physically making me respond to, but I am thinking about everybody else that's around me. Because as you know, like when you've grappled for so long, you can do it blindfolded. You you you physically don't need to see what's going on. Yeah. Um, and and that's why I push it so much. Um, and and George will get on me. So it's not just BJJ, it's uh Greco-Roman wrestling, uh catch wrestling, judo, uh what else? Muay Thai. Muay Thai. Western boxing. Yeah, all of those things. I'm I'm a big fan of all of those, but in grappling alone with the you know, judo stuff like that, you you get a sense of when you're in contact with the person, I don't have to think as much. Right. I can focus on everything else.

SPEAKER_01: 56:15

And that and that's experience. Yes. So how do we get that to our brand new officers?

SPEAKER_09: 56:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 56:20

Uh outside of exposure. And even more critically, how do we get them to think that way before the event?

SPEAKER_06: 56:28

I I again I kind of feeling yeah. I I get more into a hiring practice. I I am uh now of the opinion that in policing, and you tell me what you think because you got more experience than me, but we we make a doctor do schooling. They're prepping for the job before they ever become a doctor, right? Right? Got to get good grades in high school, they got to get good grades in college, they got to go through their prereqs, then they got to go through clinicals and all these things. A lawyer, what do they got to do? They gotta do good in school, they gotta focus on writing. They got they're like these things they know they're gonna have to do to get to that goal. If you're gonna become a cop, I'm of the opinion that we shouldn't be hiring people that just decide they want to be a cop. You have to have prepped to get into this career field. So if you want to prep to get in this career field, one of the things that you need to have done is a form of martial arts grappling. Now, I get very picky on what I think that should be boxing, judo, like things that are proven. Right. Things that are proven. And I there's got to be a test for that. You can't just tell me you did it. We gotta you gotta prove it. Yeah. And we'll be able to see that very quickly from anybody that's experienced. That is one prerequisite that I think if they had that coming in, we fixed a lot of the issues.

SPEAKER_01: 57:38

Sure. And that that goes to a point, um, education is not training. Right. So I can I could sit here and tell you, you know, how to do X, Y, and Z, but can you put X, Y, and Z in front of me on the table and can I put it back together and take it apart and show you all the parts, how they work, and then put it back together and make it work again? That's that's training. So for us, um, where that where that kind of interjects or or layers into is um this this might go over, it might not. The capacity for physical force is a prerequisite for this job. Not because we want to, but because there is an element that will resist, right? And it will always be that. And so you have to be capable, yes, have to be capable, but the intangible of it is you have to be not just competent, but internally confident. You you can't come in needing to get your validation on your competence from others. You have to have your internal validation from yourself. So it's kind of the phenomenon. Some of the most dangerous fighters on the planet are the are the kindest, gentlest, most humble person you'll ever meet.

SPEAKER_06: 58:58

I I would say that is 99% of all USU fighters.

SPEAKER_01: 59:02

Why is that? Look at these tactical operators who are legit, legit, dangerous dudes. Yeah. Nice guys, all of them, easy going, won't have conflict in the line at Albertson's because somebody cut in front of them. Why is that? It's that internal confidence, confident competence.

SPEAKER_06: 59:19

Agreed. Agreed. 100%. Um, going back to the chat, guys. We're gonna keep bouncing back to the chat. If we get wrapped up in the class, it's just because the class is so good. Um, so I apologize if we missed anybody. We definitely didn't want to miss Anthony White. He said, Lopez, one of the most well-respected and knowledgeable officers I know. Thank you so much, sir. Um love that. Prefrontal cortex. This is from somebody on LinkedIn said the prefrontal cortex is the primary brain region of making quick decisions, but it works with other areas of the habitual choices. Um and the anterior. Singulate, thank you, sir. Cortex uh to sort through options.

SPEAKER_01: 59:54

And now you're getting into all kinds of things that require even more time. Yeah. The more options you have, the more time it takes to sort through which one is best.

SPEAKER_05: 1:00:01

Yeah, that's that's from that question, was from David Cardoso off my LinkedIn.

SPEAKER_06: 1:00:05

Oh, okay, good. Um, yeah, for some reason it's not showing on here, so I apologize, uh, David. Um Brandar said, stop resisting has the same effect as I smell something. That's awesome. Well played, sir. Well played. Um no, I like that. But um yes, I I think that I'm sorry, I'm not talking on the mic. I think that with the idea of being able to process and and going through experience, so this is why this class specifically is so important to the rookie officer versus the more experienced officer. Because it's not that a more because we've watched videos on here of more experienced officers falling flat and doing stupid shit.

SPEAKER_01: 1:00:55

Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 1:00:55

They're just less likely because they've learned through the experience. Yeah, they may not be able to explain it, and I still think the class could help everybody. But the important part is right now is understanding why we're talking about what we're talking about. Um Wade Lucero said, let's fix the officer safety issue. That's my pet peeve. Hey, brother, we got a lot of things we're gonna be working on today specifically. We just want to recognize the gap in ego, understanding what ego is, uh, when to see it taking over and you're not thinking clearly.

unknown: 1:01:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:01:28

Um, because if we can start getting that problem handled, maybe we can start handling a lot of other issues. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Um, but all right, we're gonna keep moving. Um we already hit this, right? Yeah. Okay. So we got another video coming up. Let's see what the next one is. Is this the is this the one that you wanted to just talk through the sentence, the cartoon one?

SPEAKER_01: 1:01:48

Oh, yeah. It it explains a little bit about how the limbic system works and what it's in charge of and how you're literally your emotions can rede re entirely derail your thought process. Okay. I mean, you can you can be 100% perfectly trained and know the exact right answer, and you throw an emotional aspect into it and it goes out the window.

SPEAKER_06: 1:02:10

Yeah, and we see that the moment somebody goes, I'll go and you know, I'll find out who your wife is and fuck your wife.

SPEAKER_01: 1:02:16

And you see they weren't ready for that. Yeah, and all they just triggered. Yeah. And if you go take it one step back, why is that guy saying that to that officer?

SPEAKER_10: 1:02:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:02:27

Because he's angry, right? Because he's wanting to induce that. He's he's he's trying his id. Yeah, his id is not getting met. So they feed on each other.

SPEAKER_09: 1:02:37

I gotcha. Okay. This guy's so smart.

SPEAKER_01: 1:02:40

Uh so the goal is to to keep us thinking in that prefrontal cortex and not feeling in that limbic system. The the problem is that as human beings, we feel much faster than we think.

SPEAKER_10: 1:02:54

Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 1:02:55

And unless we're exposed to those feelings and then expected to think, the feeling will circumvent the thought because it's so much stronger and so much deeper in that internal instinctive part of our brains.

SPEAKER_07: 1:03:07

Unmet expectations.

SPEAKER_01: 1:03:09

That's the biggest part of anger and frustration, really.

SPEAKER_06: 1:03:12

Um let me share this photo so people can get an idea what we're talking about here. Because this man is awesome.

SPEAKER_01: 1:03:21

That's Tig, right?

SPEAKER_06: 1:03:24

Love it. Let me see. Nope, that's not what we want. We want to share the window to the wall. There we go. Check this out. All right. So we've got a 97-year-old deputy with 74 years on the job, is the oldest working officer in history. Look at the hash marks.

SPEAKER_01: 1:03:44

Three quarters of a century on there. Jesus. He's running out of sleeve. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:03:48

Yeah. He probably had to have those hash marks like made specifically smaller just to fit on there. Oh Lord.

SPEAKER_01: 1:03:57

So that's the that's the question. How do the old guys manage to be able to negotiate all of these things and they let people say things? And I don't know. I've I've worked part-time jobs where everybody around me is intoxicated. Not the fellow officers, but all of the everyone, everyone at the bar. And um everyone, once they're intoxicated, they're operating almost entirely emotionally. Their prefrontal cortex is taking a nap. And that's that's why the alcohol is considered depressant, because that's that's the effect it's having on your brain. You're not processing information the same way. It depresses the information.

SPEAKER_06: 1:04:40

You're not depressing me right now. Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:04:42

So but my point is is how do the old guys manage to negotiate with that rowdy drunk who's been asked to leave and now he wants to challenge everybody and bows up his chest and everything? So how is it the old guys can do it? But the young guys are like, okay, cool, let's go. Right. I'll throw down. I'm happy to throw down. Yeah. So that's the question. How do the old guys do it?

SPEAKER_06: 1:05:02

Gotcha. Um, Brand R86 dropped five bucks and said, uh, or the guy said it because he was swatted while in a Call of Duty lobby. Yeah. Holy shit. So just a short little side rabbit hole. Um, you know, got to play. I'm a gamer. I I I've always been a gamer, but it's always been on computers. So I don't know the the whole Xbox lobby stuff. I didn't, I didn't, it wasn't my thing. I didn't I didn't jump on those. I I would play, and when I play, I play with Discord, and Discord's always with people I know. So I'm not really listening to anybody else, but I got in an Xbox lobby with some friends when oh my god, the the amount of hate and racial shit in its 12-year-olds just get shit on like oh my god. Oh so well, it's that undeveloped prefrontal. Oh, it is, and let me tell you, like if you are any somewhat at all PC, if you're like, you know, like stuff that we used to say in the 80s and 90s, you know, that you can't really say today, and you're just like, you took it away from us. Uh Xbox Lobby thinks it's the 19 fucking 40s and they don't give a shit. So anyway, um supposedly it's getting better. But I'm going over to the uh going over to the comments. I want to read what everybody's got to say. Um if I had my choice, cops would learn the law properly, then take ego training. Most ego-driven mistakes happen when they when people know the law better than the badge, who shows up and corrects them. So sure.

SPEAKER_01: 1:06:37

But if that officer was emotionally regulated well enough to say, you know what, I'm not 100% on that. And I think I'm gonna take your word for it on this one because I'm I'm not 100% and I I'm not confident with writing you the ticket or taking you into custody or continuing this interaction without being more knowledgeable myself.

SPEAKER_06: 1:06:54

And that is the point we're trying to make, Mr. Buffold. It's not mutually exclusive. They complement each other. Knowing the law is great, but when your ego's in check and you you don't know, because how many fucking laws are there? A ton.

SPEAKER_01: 1:07:08

How often do they change?

SPEAKER_06: 1:07:09

Yeah, there's no way to keep up with them all. Lawyers, judges don't know all the laws. So even for us, I would say if you've got a good ego in check, then even on the times when you're not sure, you're able to acknowledge that, you know what? I I need more guidance on what I got, versus you're gonna fucking listen to me because you just got challenged, and we went from our prefrontal cortex into the limbic limbic system. Limbic system. See, look at me learning. Um Eye of the Night. I want to hear Izzo's take on that one. Have you listened to any of the Dominic Izzo stuff? You know who I'm talking about at all? Yes. And I've I've had him on a few times. He is very um shock jock style, yeah, but his heart is definitely in the right place. I love Izzo. I have a lot of conversations on the side um with him, and and sometimes things that I cannot say or do online, but he has the freedom to, I'll just pass it on to him and he'll talk about the topic for me. So um great dude. Great dude. Definitely back him up. Make sure you like follow, subscribe to Izzo Cop Talk Live. Great stuff. Um But let me see here. Uh go to Mr. Billfold again. He said it's simple. No amount of ego will make you think that the sidewalks are private property. Ego doesn't make you unaware of the Fourth Amendment.

SPEAKER_01: 1:08:27

You're right, but your emotion will make you forget it. Oh gets deep.

SPEAKER_06: 1:08:32

What do you mean by that?

SPEAKER_01: 1:08:34

Well, I mean you can know something and be so hot-headed or so emotional about it that you forget the logic of it. So, personal story, like I've told you, I've I've been so angry that I've done something totally outside of my nature and immediately regretted it and then had to pay the consequence for it. Okay. Having an argument with the wife. I get so pissed off, I punch a hole in the drywall. The second my hand fits that drywall, I have that negative reinforcement because it hurts. Yeah. Okay. And then I have the, oh shit. Now she's gonna be scared of me. Now this is really erupting. Now I'm losing control here. And then afterwards, I'm the guy who has to fix the drywall. But in that moment, all of those things that I knew that it was gonna hurt, that I was gonna have to repair it later, that I was gonna be scaring my wife, they didn't matter because I was mad. That's what I mean when I say your emotion will hijack that prefrontal cortex.

SPEAKER_08: 1:09:28

Because you know better.

SPEAKER_01: 1:09:29

Because you know better. You know the Fourth Amendment. But he pissed you off, so you're gonna try and get around it. And that horse is gonna leave the trail and it's gonna go.

SPEAKER_06: 1:09:39

Yeah, that makes sense. Uh, Brandon R86. Brandar, spoiling us tonight. I don't know what he did, what I did to make him happy, but he's he's loving on us. I like it. Uh he did a five-dollar super chat that said um policing is allowed to make mistakes and then go back, review the incident, and then apply new laws that they didn't know about at the time of the arrest. Um I'm trying to process that. Policing is allowed to make mistakes and then go back, review the incident, and then apply new laws they didn't know about at the time of the arrest. Can you, Brandar, can you kind of give me an example of what you mean there?

SPEAKER_01: 1:10:19

That's there's there's one there. Uh Mr. Bill Fold again. If you're emotional, I'm thinking that's what you mean. Yeah. If your emotion makes you forget it, then you do not need to be a cop. Um I'm gonna halfway agree with that. I'm not I'm gonna add the caveat of if you cannot learn to emotionally regulate yourself, you don't need to be a cop.

SPEAKER_06: 1:10:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:10:41

Because every human being has emotion.

SPEAKER_06: 1:10:44

Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 1:10:44

Every human being does.

SPEAKER_06: 1:10:45

Yeah. And you don't want cops without emotion, too. Right. That's because then you have a robot. Then you got robots. Yeah, it's a fucking fine line. It really is. Um first by first first best, Gigi said, uh, Izzo's channel is where I found your channel. Oh, very cool. Thank you very much, uh, Gigi. Um Eye of the Night said, I would also say before cops says, for example, I would also say before a cop says, for example, you were jaywalking, but then come to find out the place doesn't have jaywalking laws or the lawful requirements for jaywalking, not at a crosswalk. Correct. Um Joffreon citing vagrancy laws that don't exist. Yeah, that was a big one. Did you see that video? Uh-huh. This moron gets um, it's like a deposition, it's not like an official criminal like thing. It's like him being sued or something, and he's just kept doing, I don't remember. I don't remember. Like you could tell he was clearly like you could tell he's lying. Yeah. I mean, am I speculating technically? Yes. But we're human bullshit detectives. You can tell. He'd been coached and he was going through the motions, just piece of shit. Piece of shit. And um, but yeah, he started reciting laws that didn't fucking exist. Um again, um, poor training can't control his ego. Um, but uh all right, let's um oh, Brandar clarified here. He said police can apply the wrong law in an arrest, then review the totality of the incident and apply a different law violation later. I I yeah, that's true. That's true. I've explained this before on here where I know somebody broke a law. I'm not 100% sure which specific law it is. Like we'll go with um the one I like to use is you know, I found two different credit cards um that didn't belong to a person on them. It's a felony, it's an assumed felony because you got two credit cards that don't belong to you. Um now through the investigation, you can later find out that they were borrowing them or whatever. But until then, you were getting charged with that, you know, basically theft or identity theft or whatever it is. But you don't know that law off the top of your head unless you specialize in property crimes. Um so you'll put cuffs on somebody and you don't even know what law that they've officially broke yet. But you're you're being detained, you're putting being put in cuffs. Any reasonable person probably would believe they're under arrest already because they're being cuffed, put in the back of a car while we're looking at the law that you fucking broke. We knew you broke one, we just got to figure it out.

SPEAKER_01: 1:13:18

Or you didn't break it according to the law, and we need to get that cleared up.

SPEAKER_08: 1:13:22

Yeah, or let you go.

SPEAKER_01: 1:13:23

Yeah, because if you don't meet the elements of the offense, you don't meet the elements of the offense.

unknown: 1:13:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:13:28

Like the difference between robbery and theft. You don't know until you talk to the person that was actually harmed in the robbery.

SPEAKER_06: 1:13:34

Right. Um, and you'll hear that quite a bit. You'd be like, oh, I got robbed, and then you talk to somebody like, well, what happened? He took my purse out of my car when I was inside. Yeah. That's not robbery, it's burglary. Yeah. So um, yeah, for sure. Yeah, Mr. Bilville, he's talking about that Joffrey. And I don't recall. I don't recall. That's what that dude said. Um, Wade Lucero said, just learn to control your ego, or I can do it for you. Careful, careful. Make sure you're right. Like I said, and this goes with maturity, y'all. You can be right and fucking be hurt for it, or you can be right and just take the ride. Figure it out later. There's there's a time and a place. Only you will know. And I tell that to everybody. I put a video out recently of um cop sticking his foot in the door.

SPEAKER_09: 1:14:21

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:14:22

Um, clearly in the wrong. He had uh he had an arrest warrant for somebody he thought may be at the place, but didn't have the articulation to say for sure that per person was in there. And uh I did some follow-up on it, and the guy got hammered for a fourth amendment violation for sure. And uh, but the point being is that guy stepping over that line and not stepping back and taking the time to think about what he was doing, and all the people in the comments were just all over this dude. I lost my train of thought. I was gonna go somewhere else with that. Um, the I don't recall. Just learn to control your ego. Oh, but it became the ego. That's what I was gonna get to about him putting his foot in the door. Yeah, it became about the ego.

SPEAKER_10: 1:15:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:15:08

Um, because he wanted to know, he wanted to ask more questions. This guy wasn't having it. He's like, No, I'm gonna shut my door. And then the guy stuck his foot in the door. Yeah, it's too late, man. Um, and and you since you're here, you can actually back me up because uh the thing that I said in that video was that is a scenario we specifically train in the academy. Is uh we usually guide it as a loud music party. Yep. And it's uh I am talking like 15 to 20 cops. They're they're off duty, they're they're volunteering their time.

SPEAKER_01: 1:15:39

Several civilians, too. Yeah, lots of code blue people. Yeah. So it's a good mix. Yeah. It's not just because when when cops are the role players, you can tell that's a cop. Right. Because they talk to you like they've been talked to in the past.

SPEAKER_06: 1:15:50

Yes. But they know how to get under your skin.

SPEAKER_01: 1:15:52

That's that's exactly what I mean. Is it when put them in there so that so that they can get under that skin? That's part of the stress inoculation.

SPEAKER_06: 1:15:59

And so we we just put them through the most craziest of loud party scenarios, but the idea is to get them to open that, hold that door open or put their foot in the doorway, and then we lose our ever fucking mind on them. And it is it is literally like you know, uh a kid touching the hot pan after you told them don't touch it, don't touch it, and then they touch it and they immediately regret.

SPEAKER_01: 1:16:22

Yep. And then when you ask them about it, they know they shouldn't have. And they yes, they'll articulate. I knew I shouldn't have done it, but I was mad. The lady with the bubble gun kept getting in my face. Yeah, Jenny with the bubbles. She just irritates them. And I've had uh recruits say, Well, I'm gonna arrest you for assault because that soap and that bubble is come on, you're really gonna be that guy. Yeah, yeah, you're gonna get you're gonna be officer bubbles. Right, exactly.

SPEAKER_06: 1:16:47

All right, let's uh we're never gonna get through all this going. No worries.

SPEAKER_01: 1:16:51

So knowing yourself, just being honest with yourself, and that that's part of it. A lot of people, their ego is wrapped up in their identity or their job. Okay, I I am this, and this is expected of me, so I've got to be this guy. Yeah, I've got the the people are watching. And I've even in my training back in the day, before the turn of the century, when I was a young recruit out there on Eastide, I'd have officers say, If if you let that guy talk to you like that, the rest of the crowd is gonna talk to you like that. I was like, I don't care. They're just talking. Right. What do I care if they're talking? Let them say what they're gonna say as long as they're doing what I need them to do.

SPEAKER_06: 1:17:22

Yeah. Um, while we're on that subject, real quick, I actually got into it with some um officers in Philadelphia where I'm I watched this video, and they're they a guy's jawing at them, and the officers go into a roast section, roast session with them. Funny, yes. Completely unprofessional. Yeah. And you could tell that the officer was feeling some sort of way, was getting he was getting he was mad, so he jawed back, but he did it funny. I'm not listening it's funny. I'm not saying it's not funny, but I was like, it's unprofessional. I was like, if I was your supervisor, that'd be your ass. Like, we have no, you have no right to do that. You do I understand it, yes, but not in the uniform. I hold you to a higher standard when you're wearing that uniform. And they say, That's Philly. This is how you would never survive over here in Philly. And I'm like, I you're letting what he said get to you. Okay, I could give a shit less.

SPEAKER_01: 1:18:23

So are are you asking me to back you up on your opinion or are you asking me my opinion?

SPEAKER_06: 1:18:27

No, I I'm saying this is kind of to your point. This is what I'm getting into. Is like, now, am I the guy that has lipped off and gone back at them because I'm not gonna let them walk on me? Yeah, I've done it.

SPEAKER_01: 1:18:38

Some of that is culture too, though. True. I mean, look at we just we said on here that uh Marines. Right Marines are all gonna be berating each other. They're always gonna be Hollywood Marine or San Diego or Sand Fleece, whatever. But inside that culture, it's acceptable. Right. So you as a supervisor, you're in the unique position of having to protect and defend the honor, we'll call it, of the agency itself and bring those young officers up to a standard that you believe to be correct. But the interaction between those those officers and that civilian, that could have been the one thing that makes that civilian go, that officer's actually pretty cool.

SPEAKER_06: 1:19:21

He got agreed. I agree. That wasn't this situation. Okay, that's not what this was about. I I understand what you mean on that. Yes. Okay, a hundred percent. This wasn't that. This was he was trying to hurt him emotionally. Okay. It wasn't a it was one of those. Yeah. And I'm like, no, you can't go down.

SPEAKER_01: 1:19:41

That's a little that's a little more. You know playful banter back and forth. That's probably harmless, depending on culturally where you're at, and you know what it is you're saying, of course.

SPEAKER_06: 1:19:51

Yeah. I I looked at it as punching down. It's kind of how I saw the situation. I'm like, you're punching down, dude. Like, why?

SPEAKER_01: 1:19:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:19:57

Like this guy's going to jail. Yeah. He's already got it bad enough.

SPEAKER_01: 1:20:01

Yeah.

unknown: 1:20:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:20:02

And now you're it was just where you're coming from. I didn't like it. Um, anyway, uh Brandar dropped another. Brandar, save your money, dude. Like, I appreciate you, but let some other people share the wealth, man. I believe Brandar is military. So I know he he just needs to save his money as it is. Um, he said, if an officer has an ego-driven adverse adverse encounter, the officer's EMI should be an eight-hour shift in a COD lobby learning to emotional control.

SPEAKER_01: 1:20:34

That might be a little too much inoculation.

SPEAKER_07: 1:20:36

Bro, that's just mean.

SPEAKER_01: 1:20:38

That might be like the old psychology of shock treatment. Yeah, yeah. You know, you're it's just a little too much. That's mean. So the the this next slide that we have pulled up, um, how we can do these things. It's an it's an honest no BS self-assessment, self-assessment. I tell people that in the in the recruit classes. Um, I tell officers that. I tell officers that want to be control tactics instructors that um there are things that you cannot change about our agency, about the law, about the community you serve. There are things that you can change, and if they're changeable by you and you should change them, go for it. Okay. And learning that humility is greater than your cred, okay. If if you think about it, if you really break it down in that prefrontal cortex and using logical thought, the person that you are interacting with that has just insulted you or just called you the worst name in the book, or said something about your wife, or whatever, whatever it was that sparked that emotional response. What are literally the mathematical odds of that person being able to complete that? If if they're there, then take that appropriate step, terroristic threat, whatever. Okay. Right. Re-retaliation, whatever it, whatever it comes up. But if it's not, what does it hurt?

SPEAKER_06: 1:21:51

Let it go.

SPEAKER_01: 1:21:51

Okay. And and that's one of the things that I use a lot working these off-duties is for example, um, security is ask the guy to leave. I don't ask anybody to leave. That's their job. I back them up if it starts to breach the peace.

SPEAKER_10: 1:22:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:22:05

So they're walking them out, they want to argue, they want to sp say their piece. Their id is they want to explain why, why I did this, why, why, you know, they they need all this, why. So one of the things I'll say is I can't hear you in here. Let's go outside and we can talk as long as you need to talk to understand what's going on.

SPEAKER_06: 1:22:22

Yeah, and you're not exactly lying.

SPEAKER_01: 1:22:24

Fucking loud in those bars. Yeah, yeah. But then once we're outside, did I just complete what we need done?

SPEAKER_06: 1:22:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:22:31

Yeah, the guy needed to leave. So we got him out, okay, with with no force needed.

SPEAKER_06: 1:22:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:22:35

And then it's on me to just be okay with listening to him and having to do it.

SPEAKER_06: 1:22:39

And you weren't lying. You actually go, and that's another thing. So officers out there listening. Don't lie. Like, if you say you're gonna go out there to listen to them, unless you plan on arresting them and you're just trying to keep it like, you know, so you know other people don't get hurt, because cops can lie. Uh, I do think there is a time and a place, like, especially if you try not to get anybody else hurt, you don't want to escalate the situation. Um, there are times for it. So I get that. But if you aren't planning to arrest and you say, Yeah, legitimately, I want it, just tell me your side. If that will keep them calm for the remainder, yeah, go outside and listen to them.

SPEAKER_01: 1:23:15

And 90% of the time I've I've found that that's all they wanted.

SPEAKER_06: 1:23:18

Yeah, they want to be heard. Yeah, they just want to say their peace. I'm with you.

SPEAKER_01: 1:23:22

You have to be humble enough to listen. You can't you can't be the guy who says, No, I already told you you're leaving, it's time to go.

SPEAKER_06: 1:23:27

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 1:23:27

You set your heels, they're gonna set their heels.

SPEAKER_06: 1:23:29

Because you get emotionally wrapped up into the you're I'm the authority in your perceived disrespect or your need for respect.

SPEAKER_01: 1:23:40

Yes. That's id driven.

SPEAKER_06: 1:23:42

Yes. So I'm with you. Um, Mr. Bill Fold said, Um, this is why I like these guys. They are fighting a losing battle, a losing fight, and that is my whole life story. Cops will never change. Too many jurisdictions to police themselves for any change to happen. Hope springs eternal. Hope springs eternal. I like that. And and Mr. Billfold, if there's one thing you've learned about me, is that I surround myself with like-minded people as far as my drive goes. George is one of those. Banning is one of those. Um, so it yes, I'm going to annoy you with my optimism and my positivity and my hope. Sorry, brother. Uh, it is what it is. It what it isn't.

SPEAKER_01: 1:24:27

Um, because anything other than that is just surrender.

SPEAKER_06: 1:24:30

Yeah. And Marines don't surrender. That's right. Ooh, I got you, Mr. Billfold. Now you're in a conundrum. Uh, let's go to this next video. Let me uh share the screen here. And guys, these videos are actually a part of the class. So these aren't videos we just pulled up for y'all. This is the right video, correct?

SPEAKER_07: 1:24:55

Yes.

SPEAKER_06: 1:24:55

Okay. So we will play.

SPEAKER_13: 1:25:03

You understand that? I'm not speaking. I got a I got a fucking dash cam with my GPS on it, buddy. That's not illegal, buddy.

SPEAKER_11: 1:25:14

This is correct. It is not illegal to flip off a cop. However, this is what the cop does now.

SPEAKER_13: 1:25:20

It's not illegal. You just committed a crime. No, I do not get license to registration. I haven't committed no crime. What's what's my crime?

SPEAKER_03: 1:25:28

What's my crime, buddy? What's my crime?

SPEAKER_13: 1:25:32

Paste me, paste me, buddy. Let me see your thing. Let me see your guard. Let me see your gun, buddy. You paste me. Get out of here. Let me see your radar gun. I'm not giving you registration. You pulled me over unlawfully, sir. Santos, number 620. No, I'm not giving you advice for registration. Pull me over unlawfully, buddy. Unlawful pullover.

SPEAKER_01: 1:25:53

So uh I'm sure you guys have picked something either this video or something very similar in the past. Okay, you've picked it apart, you've gone through it. Clearly, both people in this interaction are emotional.

SPEAKER_09: 1:26:06

Yes.

SPEAKER_01: 1:26:07

So the officer has been fronted. You pulled me over for no reason. And the driver is clearly emotional as well. So going back to can we all use a little emotional regulation? 100%. Okay, because could this be avoided by that driver having some emotional regulation and saying, you know what, officer, if that's what you say, cool. Here we go. Here's this, here's this, here's this. I'll see you in court. Thank you very much. Problem solved, right? Or the officer says, you know what? You're you're right. Um, I'm just gonna let you go with a warning. Or uh I would appreciate it if you didn't flip me off. That was kind of disrespectful, or whatever.

SPEAKER_04: 1:26:42

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 1:26:42

But more open, better communication to solve that on from both sides. So the reason I I include this video is because what it ends up being is that this officer sets his heels on it being the way it's going to be, and the driver is doing the same thing. And the driver in this instance is in the right. You you it's not probable cause to pull someone over for flipping them off. Yeah, we've got that's a First Amendment protection.

SPEAKER_06: 1:27:08

Yeah, there's actually a court case on that. Um, I've pulled it up before, but I that's there's a Supreme Court ruling that, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:27:17

Specifically in traffic, yeah. Yeah. Side note to that, training-wise, I use that little tactic in the recruit classes.

SPEAKER_10: 1:27:24

Oh, you flip them off.

SPEAKER_01: 1:27:25

So our recruits are they're they're dictated to greet every person that they see in the hallways. Good morning, sir, good morning, sir, good morning, ma'am, good morning, ma'am. And when they say that to me, I flip them off. And they laugh and they giggle, Officer Lopez, that's so funny. Uh they one day we'll get you back. But there's a subcontext to that. I'm doing that so that the next time they're out on some road and some sketchy area and they drive past some guy and he flips them off, instead of them being offended, and they laugh. They go, Oh, just like Lopez used to flip me off in the academy. And you know, if I can do those subtle little things, it it's a little bit helpful. At least that's that's my thinking.

SPEAKER_06: 1:28:02

Uh Mr. Bill Fold said, I never said surrender, I said we are fighting a losing fight. By all means, keep fighting, but do not fool yourselves in things and things will change. Sorry, sir. I disagree. I think if I fix, or I say fix, that's a terrible way to say it. If I have one officer that takes something that we teach and they take it out to the field and it makes a difference to the people they interact with, did I not make a change?

SPEAKER_01: 1:28:30

So, Mr. Billfold, Billfold, both are emotional. The driver has a right to be, the cop does not. Okay. It has nothing to do with the right to be emotional. You are a human being, you're going to be emotional. And that's that's the whole point of this. It's it's not that I have a right to be emotional because I have the authority. I'm emotional because I'm a human being. It's not that you have the right to be emotional because you're just happily driving on your way and you're pulled over and inconvenienced and taken away from your primary task and having to deal with an officer who doesn't know what he's talking about. All of those inconveniences that that disrupt your day, that it doesn't give you a right to be emotional. You're going to be emotional. The key is to learn how to navigate that emotion before it becomes a problem.

SPEAKER_07: 1:29:12

Yeah. Um, let me get to the next video. It goes video to video, back to back, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_10: 1:29:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07: 1:29:23

Okay, so let me stop sharing.

SPEAKER_06: 1:29:29

This is the problem with not having an Alan in the background. There we go. We got nobody in the background today, guys. It's just me. Bannings bannings over there looking disheveled.

unknown: 1:29:41

All right.

SPEAKER_01: 1:29:42

I'm pretty sure this is a pretty popular video, too. The guy pulled over the motorcycle riders.

SPEAKER_09: 1:29:47

Okay.

SPEAKER_03: 1:29:48

Well, there's always a reason, but I'm not going to share it. Okay. Yeah. I'm going to be on my way. Have a good day. You're going to stay here for a second. Are you detaining me?

SPEAKER_02: 1:29:55

Yes. In Hibbing, Minnesota, then is police sergeant Black Everett. The sergeant has stopped Ryan Swanson, who runs the YouTube site, Good Citizen of the North. Moments earlier, Swanson was filming government buildings on public property. You may have a very legitimate reason.

SPEAKER_03: 1:30:10

Can you explain that to me? Or you don't care to explain it. Can I see your identification? Have I broken a law? I don't know, but people take things very seriously when it comes to uh public safety and military safety. And if you've been walking around the property photographing things, I don't think it's unreasonable for me to ask.

SPEAKER_02: 1:30:31

It's not unreasonable for a police officer to ask for an ID, but it is against the Constitution and settled case law to demand an ID without reasonable articulable suspicion of a crime.

SPEAKER_03: 1:30:42

Now you asked me a few questions from my computer and my name and batch number, I was more than willing to provide that with you. Which I believe you're required to do. Yep. I'm not.

SPEAKER_02: 1:30:52

Well, if uh we have a reason to believe you may be involved in criminal activity, you need a reasonable, articulable suspicion that I have M or I'm about to commit a crime to be able to detain you.

SPEAKER_03: 1:31:03

What are you? So what am I being detained for? Identification purposes.

SPEAKER_06: 1:31:07

In order to ID Which we already know with a lot of the stuff that we've put out, that that is not a reason to ID.

SPEAKER_01: 1:31:15

Yeah. So the the reason I include videos like this is that at the recruit level, from what they're hearing, they're just hearing some, they're just hearing cop talk. But what we're seeing is that this cop doesn't know what he's talking about and he's trying to make it fit.

SPEAKER_07: 1:31:31

Right.

unknown: 1:31:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:31:32

Trying to double down, like you said. Gotcha. So when we talk about humility, and we talk about humility a lot, we're talking about the quality of being free from pride or arrogance. Okay. Humble doesn't mean you think less of yourself. It's just that you think of yourself less. Um in the realm of public service, there is what we call the priority of life, right? In in exigent circumstances, critical incidents, all of those things. You've got hostages, innocent bystanders, first responders, and then suspect subjects on the priority of life that we are tasked with defending as best we can to keep safe, right? So if you notice on that priority of life, we're number three hostages and bystanders, then the public, then the first responders.

SPEAKER_09: 1:32:19

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 1:32:19

So we have to have, I can't even call it a mindset. I would call it, and this is just you know, George being George, call it a heart set. Um I have to be okay with being the less important person in that interaction because that's the only way I'm going to be able to communicate to you while you're emotional, while you're emotional, um, what needs to be done in this interaction. Is to and you like I said before, you're never going to completely um remove emotions from human beings. And someone said it's time for Robocops. No emotions, no warnings, no exceptions, no discretion, pre-programmed responses. Um self-checkout. Yeah. Automated anything. Yeah. That's that's what you'll have with police work. And police work, um the human element, it's gonna you're gonna lose something there. Yeah. Plus, how is a robot going to testify to reasonableness or probable?

SPEAKER_10: 1:33:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:33:22

It either is or it isn't. And that that that might be problematic. It's a nice idea.

SPEAKER_07: 1:33:28

Can you read that?

SPEAKER_01: 1:33:30

Let's see. Thoughts on humility? Uh yeah. Not inflating or reducing your place in the world, but fitting into your place correctly. Understanding that as the cop, you are the public servant. The servant. I am here to help you. It could be that the reason I'm here interacting with you is because you've broken the law and I am serving the public by taking you out of that situation briefly until a judge can determine whether or not you are guilty or innocent. I have no I have no say in your guilt or innocence. What I have is probable cause to believe that this has happened, and it's time for me to make a seizure under Fourth Amendment for it to be decided by a judge.

SPEAKER_07: 1:34:08

Right.

SPEAKER_06: 1:34:09

Mr. Billfold said uh you guys have never been wrongfully arrested or beaten by cops, so you will never understand why we are tired of the untrained tyrants with guns who ride rough shod overshod. Oh roughshod over our lives. Yeah, you you're right. It's a good horse term. Yeah, roughshod. You are going to have an experience that we cannot relate to.

SPEAKER_01: 1:34:31

I can relate to being beat up by cops, though.

SPEAKER_07: 1:34:33

So can you? Oh shit. Okinawa. You got beat up by MPs? Oh shit.

unknown: 1:34:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:34:41

Actually, it was the JPs. We got past the MPs. They were they were short patrol.

SPEAKER_06: 1:34:47

Short patrol? Sure. Sure. Oh, sure. Yeah. I would say, well, they're probably short too.

SPEAKER_01: 1:34:51

Uh but as as far as wrongfully arrested, um, I I can I can see where you're coming from with that. There's there's there's plenty of examples. Examples. Yeah, there's plenty of examples. I can't argue that point.

SPEAKER_06: 1:35:02

Yeah, and and to sit back and and again, I would never minimize your experience, Mr. Billfold. Um it's just we're we're we're trying, brother. We are trying. Umle, Texas said, George is exactly right. Um, Nat is actually our Facebook mod. Oh, okay. She's been kicking ass, taking names. So um very thankful for having her a part of what we do. We're trying to get her into what we're doing. So I'll let you get into your okay.

SPEAKER_01: 1:35:32

So this is a new um acronym that I've I've discovered. There is a psychiatrist, Dr. Mark Barrett, um, one R2Ts. And he is part of Talent Smart EQ training. So basically, he's put together this quick little um acronym that can be helpful in identifying our ego problems or our emotional responses. And it's basically a ruler. You want to be the ruler, if you can think of it, be the ruler of your emotions. And what's critical to that is to recognize that you're having an emotional response. First and foremost, you have to recognize that what you are talking, dealing with, um, articulating, explaining, you are no longer in the realm of logic and reason. You are now feeling and trying to explain your feelings, but you're not doing it well enough. You're trying to set your terms, you're trying to double down, like you said. So you've got to recognize when that's happening. And then you need to understand what it is that you're feeling. I'm angry, I'm upset. And there's there's such a spectrum of feelings that we could get into, but we we won't for the sake of brevity here. But anger is not just across the board always anger. Would you say there's a difference between wrath and frustration?

SPEAKER_10: 1:36:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:36:46

Absolutely. So there's a spectrum of anger, there's a spectrum of sadness, there's a spectrum of love and joy and all of those feelings and emotions that are powerful. So you need to be able to understand specifically what is happening in your brain at that time. And then you can label it. If you can put a word on it, you are now adding prefrontal cortex reasoning to an emotion. Okay. So if you am I screaming, no, it was me.

SPEAKER_06: 1:37:17

I I typed out ruler to them so they knew what it meant. And I did an all caps thing.

SPEAKER_01: 1:37:21

Okay. Like you're yelling. Yeah. So when you if you can name it, you can tame it. Do you know this person? Elena? That's my daughter, yeah. Thank you so much, Knucklebutt. Oh, that's Knucklebutt? That's my knucklebutt. I remember that.

SPEAKER_06: 1:37:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:37:35

That's awesome. So labeling the emotion helps us go from feeling the emotion to starting to think about the emotion.

SPEAKER_04: 1:37:41

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 1:37:42

I can see your frustration. We use this in de-escalation all the time. If I'm trying to de-escalate you, I'm getting you to talk about what you're feeling, and then I'm giving it back to you. I'm paraphrasing, I'm doing all those active listening skills. But we can do that with ourselves, and we should do it with them with ourselves. I'm I'm really upset right now. Why am I so pissed off? Well, really, it's because of I I think I think I messed up, and now I'm scared because I'm gonna get in trouble because this guy knows the law better than I do. So what do I do? I have to start figuring out ways to emotionally rein myself in so that I can get it back.

SPEAKER_08: 1:38:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:38:15

Okay. And then expressing, not so much for us to as law enforcement to be able to express our feelings for whatever situation we're in. I I don't have to, I don't see any great, great need or great value in telling someone that I'm interacting with, you know what, the thing that you just told me really hurts my feelings. Yeah. That really makes me sad. I don't I don't see any real value in that. However, if I can acknowledge that that's what I'm feeling, that can help me process and get back to the thinking about it. And then regulating the emotion. Okay, we have uh there's a psychological therapy theory called cognitive behavior therapy. And in there is this concept of cognitive distortions. So a cognitive distortion is literally a wrong thought. You you have said something and I have processed that information incorrectly, and it has induced an emotional response on my part.

SPEAKER_10: 1:39:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:39:13

So I have to be able to regulate what that cognitive distortion is. And that can either be through more communication with you, right, by saying, Hey, clarify what you mean by that.

SPEAKER_06: 1:39:23

Yeah, like if you were to say, like, I remember my first time teaching shuffle step. Right. And I would be like, What the fuck do you mean by that?

SPEAKER_01: 1:39:29

Right. Yeah. Yeah. So you acknowledging that and you having that response right there shows me that you can regulate that emotion because at the time you were probably feeling very embarrassed.

SPEAKER_06: 1:39:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:39:41

You were probably like, crap, I'm stuck. I don't know what to do.

SPEAKER_06: 1:39:44

We should, we should probably tell that story. Um, so I'm a new instructor. Um, and I am I'm the new control tactics guy. Um, and and George is my my backup and uh my my co-instructor. And I have my first class that is my class. They don't just throw a class at you. You got to go through and be like an assistant for other classes, and then you get your own class. And I step out onto the mats, and I am teaching the very first move that we teach these guys in a fight, and it's just called shuffle step. And it's literally what it sounds like. You just shuffle forward, you shuffle backwards, and uh I get out to the mats, and I all the stuff I know, and I know what I want to say, and I just brain fart and freeze up. And I'm like, all right, guys, so today we're gonna go over shuffle step. And uh the thing about shuffle step, and I feel it coming over me, and I'm like, ah fuck, I don't know what I'm gonna say. Um, so George is gonna come out here and demonstrate shuffle step for us. And uh George, without missing a beat, jumps out there, okay, guys. Shuffle step. We're gonna fight. This is what we do, this is how it looks, da da da da. And he he takes over like the mastery is. Now, we have such a good system, as long as it's being followed, set up, um, that you are always ready to step in as the more senior instructor, or um, even you don't even necessarily have to be the more senior, just ready just in case something like that happens, because it happens. You don't want to lose credibility in front of students. They gotta trust that you know what you're talking about, and that when you don't, that you're able to handle it in a way that instills confidence. I did not know how to teach the technique at the time. I did know how to teach it. I just I brain farted, I had a bad move. And so I asked George to step in. He steps in, he teaches it, and it became a joke. What it was that was in 2016, 2017, it's still a joke today.

SPEAKER_01: 1:41:39

Yeah, well, no, it became a great teaching point too for future instructors. It did. So it's it's not so much how it's not so how much you know, it's how much can you transfer to the student. Yes. So um let me go to the comments here, real quick. Okay. Uh Twitchy skitch said Halt can help you identify your emotions, hungry, angry, lonely, tired, or sad. Identify it, and then you can deal with it. That's great. Yeah, it's a that's a great tool. Hungry is usually and if you if you were taught that, if you were taught that early on in your career, you are you are very blessed because a lot of officers don't get that kind of insight.

SPEAKER_10: 1:42:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:42:12

And uh Mr. Billfold, uh bouncer and doorman at the worst dive strip club outside Camp Lejeune, never let it get to you, wasn't paid enough to react emotionally to assholes. Uh that's a good hiring set.

SPEAKER_06: 1:42:25

Yeah, I know we are hiring. I wish I dude, bro, I it'd be so fun if he came out. Um I I don't know his life situation per se. Yeah. Um, but yeah, guys like him, I would love to come out.

SPEAKER_01: 1:42:38

Yeah, that's a character thing that you can't teach, man.

SPEAKER_06: 1:42:40

Yep, absolutely. Um yeah, Twitchy Sketch said Halt is a tool that can also help uh stop depressing emotions by identifying them so they can be dealt with head on. Yep. Agreed. Um, okay, let's go to our next uh so yeah, when you guys hear his joke about shuffle step, if you hear me and George joke about that's that's where that came from. Um, because I I was a snot-nosed instructor, came out uh probably uh I don't know if I was cocky, but I was excited to do it. And uh you weren't cocky, and it just kept George on his toes every day, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_01: 1:43:16

Uh okay, so so emotional intelligence, emotions are a part of every everybody's life experience. Everyone is is experiencing emotions, they're processing emotions, they're they're trying to get their prefrontal cortex to line up with emotions. Everybody is going through it, okay. Learning how to effectively regulate it and not suppress or deny or ignore because that's that's a whole different set of problems. Um you're a Seinfeld guy. Yes. Serenity now. Serenity now. Insanity later. Yeah, and that and that's all that is, and that's a very common theme in cop psychology.

SPEAKER_10: 1:43:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:43:52

If you look at lots of cops, they are depressed, they are um, they have addiction problems, they have all the problems across the spectrum that every that every human being goes through. Okay, but you expect more from cops, and that's part of it as well, because we can't or we're not supposed to. And then when we do, we end up getting in trouble for our emotional outbursts and whatnot.

SPEAKER_10: 1:44:16

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 1:44:16

So that's that's part of it. And you can't turn off emotion. You you can't just not be angry. I mean, really, the the best proof anyone should need of this is going back to the dishwasher scenario. You've loaded the dishwasher wrong, and your wife gives you this look, and you can tell she's upset because she's told you a hundred times that cups go in the top rack, not on the bottom. And you did it anyway, and you feel disrespected. So now you're feeling this flash of anger, and she's feeling this flash of irritation because you're doing it wrong again. If you want her to turn off her emotion, just say the words calm down. Yeah, that works every time. You can't turn off emotion. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:44:56

Okay. Um, okay, let's go to the next.

unknown: 1:45:05

No?

SPEAKER_01: 1:45:05

Oh, yeah. Um, I'm sorry, I was reading uh Mr. Billfoot again. Great, great interaction there with that, and I appreciate that. Um going hands-on as a last resort, you're absolutely right. Uh, it should be that way. And if more cops had actual hands-on experience before they got a batch, yeah, I agree. And that's not that's not a training problem, that's a hiring problem.

SPEAKER_06: 1:45:28

A hiring, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:45:29

What what where are we pooling our people from? Yep. Where are we recruiting from?

SPEAKER_06: 1:45:35

And then you got to start looking at political pressures on if if if you have poor politics in your city, recruitment's gonna be way down. When recruitment goes way down, now you got a manpower issue and recruitment standards go down.

SPEAKER_01: 1:45:48

Yeah. Because they got to fill in the fill in the bricks. So what we have as as street cops or even trainers, or recruits, or citizens who have had interactions with the cops is a street level view or a floor-level view. What people in the hiring arena or the recruiting arena or the management administration, they have a 35,000 foot view.

SPEAKER_10: 1:46:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 1:46:12

So they see things in our department, in our agency, and in the in the in the profession that we simply don't. And we see things that they simply don't. So trying to bridge the gap, this this is what this is about, is trying to get that that kind of information out there.

SPEAKER_09: 1:46:27

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01: 1:46:28

So we talk a little bit about self-discipline and self-control and what those things mean. Um, self-discipline is the ability to suppress um instinct. Uh, I want it and I'm strong enough to take it, so I'm gonna take it. So, but if you have self-discipline, you can reason with it's not right for me to take it just because I'm bigger and stronger and I can take it from them. Okay, that's that's an example. Um it requires conscious effort. You have to be able to stay in that reasoning mind so that your it doesn't take over. Um, self-control is effortful regulation of the self by the self. It's internal. You you are the person in control of yourself. And that's kind of a stoic mindset. Um, some people think stoics means stoicism means you you just don't care about it. It's it's more that you don't invest emotion into something that you cannot change.

SPEAKER_07: 1:47:19

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 1:47:19

It's more of a uh you you you have no effect on the environment, you can only affect how you react to that environment.

SPEAKER_06: 1:47:26

And I it's something I actually raised my kids with that I got from my English teacher in high school, um, Mr. McBride, uh R.I.P. Uh he taught us very early, concentrate on what you can control.

SPEAKER_01: 1:47:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:47:40

And I was like, you know, at the time you you kind of got it, but you didn't get it. But as you aged and matured, I understand what he meant. Yeah. And I think that goes into what we're talking about here.

SPEAKER_01: 1:47:50

So we talk about the characteristics of self-discipline, being able to stop an impulsive response, uh, delaying gratification. That's a big one. Okay. And that that leads us into problems as human beings, not just in the use of force arena or in law enforcement. That that's a that's a big problem with um nationwide debt. The average American family is tens of thousands of dollars in debt. And it's because we've been conditioned to not delay our gratification. Yeah, you saw my house. Yeah, I'm in debt. So you've got you've got you can have it now. 60 months, 0% interest. You can't afford that. Seven-year loan, you'll be fine. You can't afford that car. Yeah. You can't afford that car. Yeah. And you have to have the ability to say, I can't afford that car. I'm gonna live with the car that I can't afford. Yeah, and that's self-limiting. And it doesn't, our id doesn't like that.

SPEAKER_10: 1:48:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:48:45

I I do think the truck loan that I have, I do think it was like a six-year loan. I really do. Uh don't get me wrong, we we paid more on it than, but just to get it, we were like, oh, we gotta. So all right, I think we're going to uh video. Yeah, sure. I got the right one.

SPEAKER_08: 1:49:05

Share.

SPEAKER_06: 1:49:06

Is that the right one? Yes. So glad we came in early and put these things in order. We really put this together well for being the first time we've ever done it. It's going smooth. So um I will rewind here and Mr. Billfold. I do remember line training.

SPEAKER_00: 1:49:29

She's in cuffs?

SPEAKER_07: 1:49:31

She is in cuffs. She is.

SPEAKER_06: 1:49:48

I don't speak Spanish, but I'm pretty sure she just said, Did you get that on camera?

SPEAKER_01: 1:49:52

Right. Yeah, he's and he's saying, uh I'm recording it, I'm recording it. So the the the the teaching point for the recruits on this is that that officer has a very quick emotional response. There are three officers on that arrested person.

SPEAKER_06: 1:50:04

And she's incuffs. And she's in handcuffs. She's already cuffed.

SPEAKER_01: 1:50:07

So and seated. Yeah. So what's the fucking rush?

SPEAKER_05: 1:50:10

So that's a do not friggin' strike all day long.

SPEAKER_01: 1:50:15

All day long. Right. So but what happens is is you can you can really you have to zoom in to see it, and it's really, it's really not that important to the point, but she does try to kick him. And I I I don't know where it landed or if it hurt or anything, but the fact that that happened took him out of that prefrontal cortex and straight into that emotional response of who do you think you are hitting me? Right. I'm the person in charge here, and I know I can strike in an intermediate force response to someone who's striking me, and the emotion takes over the reason. Right.

SPEAKER_06: 1:50:47

Instead of looking at that bigger picture. Right. Did it do any damage? Is it something that I can get out of the way of? Right. Did I put myself in a bad spot? Like what's more important? Make her pay for hitting me or don't get hit again. Right. Don't get hit again. All right, put myself in a bad spot. Yeah. You know, and and if you want to do a chintzy charge on something that's on that's on you. Uh it's not my style. Right. Um, because like I said at the end of the day, bad guys are gonna do bad guy stuff, good guys are gonna do good guy stuff. I I signed up for that. I'm not going to to give you a charge on something that is just a part of the business. Right. I I look at that as being a part of the business.

SPEAKER_01: 1:51:26

But if we take it a step back, her kicking him is an emotional response as well. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_06: 1:51:32

I don't I don't think that's in her behavior.

SPEAKER_01: 1:51:34

So normally. Normally she wouldn't. Yeah. Yep, exactly.

SPEAKER_05: 1:51:38

Let me ask a question to both y'all. Yes, sir. Just in reference to this emotional response. And and and I think the three of us combined and the amount of people that we have trained in our prospective fields, uh and I'm going into FTO training here on this question. When I started FTO training, I always wanted to know as soon as possible what is going to be my emotional response from the from the male or female young young officer that I have riding with me. And and where I got a lot of the, and I I could be wrong on this, but this is where Banning got a lot of answers, especially out here working in the middle of friggin' nowhere. Um, we would get dispatched to a call, and I want you to keep in mind 80% of our roads out here that in the middle of nowhere in Jack County are are 70 to 75 miles an hour. And if you have somebody fall asleep or somebody's intoxicated and they drift across and they collide with oncoming traffic, it's a very, very bad scene, just like it would be on any highway. But out here there's no nothing to protect you going across in these country roads. The emotional response of somebody that just came out of the civilian world, went through the police academy, they may or may not have had military training. And I would literally pause everything, make sure everybody's safe on scene who's who's still alive. But look at the emotional response of your recruit when they look into a back seat and see a child that's lifeless or somebody that's been ejected. Are you taking that in as an FTO to where you can use this as a training scenario once the call is over with? But what is their emotional response during that? I mean, that that's gonna take them from zero to a hundred pretty fast if they've got a beating heart in their chest. And I used to use that to help with my training throughout their phases, being the FTO coordinator of watching where they're going. Because I don't know if y'all got that when you when you went to accidents with these young male and female recruits or young officer cadets, whatever you want to call them. Um, but that was a huge indicator to me on how they're gonna swing on other calls. Granted, it that's gonna make anybody that's got a beaten heart in their chest just go ballistic inside. But what is their external doing during that investigation while we're assisting what we're doing? I mean, what do you what are your thoughts on that, George?

SPEAKER_01: 1:54:00

Um, well, that's that's that's one of those things that you just can't train. How do you how do you replicate that in a scenario for someone to experience in a safe sterile environment? And and and it it's it's impossible because there's number one, that's that's that's human life, and you can't, we we don't toy with that. The the principal factor in any of our training is always gonna be uh safety of the recruit and the trainee and the student and the instructor and everyone around. So there's there's parameters that you just can't violate to get that realistic of a scenario. So and that that plays in well uh with the the next slide here. It's called a Jihari window, and it's a it's another tool for self-assessment, really. I'm gonna pull it up here. So you have these four boxes here. It's gonna pull it up. Let me share the window. You have basically things that you know that other people know about you, and you also have things that um you know about yourself that you don't let other people know. That's your hidden area, you know. Um Eric likes anime. I do. So drag fuzzy, but not everybody knows that. So that's part of his hidden area. And then there's things that you don't know about yourself, but that other people know about you. Okay. Um think seventh grade, it's time to start using deodorant. Nobody nobody has a problem with recognizing that you need deodorant, but you probably don't notice it. So there's things about yourself that you don't know and things that other people know. Okay. My wife says I snore, but I don't know. I've never woken myself up with snoring. And then there's that big unknown spot, which is what you're referring to, is um we don't know something about ourselves and other people don't know it about ourselves. And that's frequently what comes up under high stress critical incidents. That's why we have training like uh close quarter survival training. Because if you've never experienced being punched in the face by a superior opponent in when you're in a fatigued condition, you don't know how you're gonna react. You might run, you might fight, you might just curl up and give up. We need to, we need to be able to know that. So the I guess um what you're asking me is my thoughts on that is that it's you're you're absolutely right. It is a factor, and we do need to see those things, but we really don't have an opportunity to see them until it's a real world experience with real world consequence. And at that point, it becomes uh the task of the FTO to articulate whether or not that person is compatible with law enforcement or not. Gotcha. Because you you can't replicate those in training, and you can't you can't um you can't go back and retrain that either. I can't run them through a s uh simulator scenario on something like that and replicate the emotional content of it.

SPEAKER_08: 1:56:44

Gotcha. Did you cover this part here? I did. Okay. Yeah. Just trying to go through. Oh, yeah, you went through all of these. Yeah. Look at you knowing your stuff.

SPEAKER_01: 1:56:53

All right. So a couple principles that you can apply to this jihari window, once you recognize things about yourself that others have brought to your attention or um that you are giving yourself a self-assessment on, is being open and communicative. You can you can increase the size of the open area. You can tell people about things. You can be it's it's okay to tell people, you know what, I'm not really that good in jujitsu. And I don't like jujitsu that much. I like judo. I like Sambo. Something about the tactical man hugs? Something about the intimacy of jujitsu. A little too much.

SPEAKER_06: 1:57:26

Well, I may have uh created George's fear. You ruined it for me. Yeah, whispering in his ear while I got him wrapped up like taste the rainbow.

SPEAKER_01: 1:57:34

And he doesn't like it. But that that kind of openness is always going to be good for our communication in any relationship, not just police interaction.

SPEAKER_06: 1:57:44

Um so we got some we got some comments going on here. Let me uh Mr. Billfold said, I am too old to be a cop, Eric. I would come out there and work with your folks. At least y'all have standards. A B uh A1B2C386 said Officer Lopez is easily one of the most badass officers on the department. I like it. Appreciate it. Thank you very much. I agree. There's George is one of my favorite cops. Out of my top, he's in my top ten cops ever. Um, so out of a department of ten. Uh yeah. Uh and then Brand R86 said, Does police training have a form of the Kobayashi Maru? I love that he went with a Star Trek reference.

SPEAKER_01: 1:58:24

You know what? I don't know the details of the Kobayashi Maru, but I know that it's an supposed to be an unwinnable situation to determine your character.

SPEAKER_06: 1:58:31

Yes. Uh to face fear or to to acknowledge the fear and still push through. Um if I remember what uh James T. Kirk's father did.

SPEAKER_01: 1:58:41

Well, he he cheated to win. And no, you're not supposed to be able to win. Correct. I like it. It's it's supposed to gauge your reaction to something being unwinnable.

SPEAKER_06: 1:58:50

Right. Brandar, that is a I actually really like that question. I think that's a very fun and um different question than I've ever heard. Could you kind of give more to that? Because I would love to hash that out a little bit more. I think that's a very that's an interesting thing. I wonder what I want, I want to know what your thoughts are on that. I want to go deeper into that question, sir. Um, but let's go into the principles here.

SPEAKER_01: 1:59:12

So the second principle is to seek out and incorporate correction. Okay, I do this as an instructor. Uh, I've not just been teaching control tactics and physical training, but just uh all of the spectrum. I mean, legislative updates, uh interacting with uh hard of hearing, ego stuff, knife stuff, uh all kinds of stuff. And the the thing that we have um as part of our training is an evaluation at the end of the class. And evals. Yeah, and those can very easily become check the box. You know, hey, I need an eval from you guys so that you can get credit for the class and check, check, check, check, and a NA NA, whatever. So I make it very specifically clear and I I I pretty much beg for input from especially the recruits, because the recruits are in a in a they're in a a segue. We're taking someone from being a civilian and rewiring their initial instinctive response to leave conflict and go towards conflict. And that's a hard thing to rewire. Um, so their their perspective on how I'm presenting material to help them make that leap is very important to how I present it and to how I train. So seeking out and and taking correction is a big thing, and that's a humility thing. Yes. You have to be okay with somebody saying, you know what, that class sucks. Yep. That class was boring. I way too many videos. Yep, you got too scientific, whatever. But that class is gonna be less messed up as the next one because I'm gonna take what you just told me and I'm gonna make the next class better.

SPEAKER_06: 2:00:48

Right. But that takes you as being the person that doesn't get emotionally invested into a product that you put a lot of time and effort in. Right. That's hard to do. Um, I'll give you, and this is just me um laying laying my business out there. Um, I'm a I'm still what I would consider a baby sergeant in the grand scheme of of where we're at at our police department. And I'm now on a specialized unit and I'm surrounded by champs, you know, Camacho, uh, Watkins, uh Joe Ship. Um, you know, my Joe Ship's out of my class. And and one of my um my lieutenant just retired or is about to retire. He's done. He just got to turn his stuff in. But Ward, you know, been around forever. Um Alan East is now my lieutenant. So I am surrounded by just well-seasoned, conditioned, specialized unit pros. I'm not there. And I am, you know, I get to this unit. I am so used to thriving. Get to control tactics, I know how to do control tactics. Uh get to teaching. I have no problem teaching. I love to teach. I'm I got an educational, you know, mindset. I get to a specialized unit. You know, I was I did patrol. You saw me out in patrol. I was out on foot every day. I loved what I did. I was thriving, teaching young minds, you know, young rookie officers. Loved it. I get to a specialized unit and I am a moron. I'm an idiot. There's so many things I don't know, and I'm frustrating my co-sargents because I'm I'm causing them more work and to the point where they had to pull me in the office. Yeah. Imagine that.

unknown: 2:02:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 2:02:26

And I ate it like a champ, dude. And I try to tell people, I'm like, and I I saw the look in their eyes, they felt so awful that they had to have this conversation, but they knew it was necessary to help me grow.

SPEAKER_04: 2:02:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 2:02:38

And I looked at all of them and I probably used a little emotional intelligence. I said, guys, don't feel bad. I was like, I love this. I love that you care enough about me to help me mold and become a better sergeant. I am going to take what give me a chance to prove I'm going to take what you're saying to. And I'm gonna fix it. Right. Um, but don't feel bad about it.

SPEAKER_01: 2:02:59

It's great. That's that's some that's some high level emotional intelligence you got going there.

SPEAKER_06: 2:03:03

Right. And so and I I I I want people to realize that even at uh there's no point that that ends. It's you're gonna have to continue to do this. Yeah. Even at the sergeant level, even at the lieutenant level. Like there's no you never get to the point where you're like, I got it solved, I got it all down.

SPEAKER_01: 2:03:17

And it's a good place to be because you're you're you're always learning. Yes. And you're you're keeping your mind sharp. For me, that that's that's part of it.

SPEAKER_06: 2:03:24

I I even called uh because um Marine, uh not Marine, but um Mr. Billfold is uh I've had him on the show a couple of times. He started out as like um kind of against the grain, didn't really care for what we were doing. Um we started to kind of win him over to the point where I got him on the show. He actually debated Von Kleem. Wow. Yeah, yeah, live on the air. Like it's crazy. So, but I've called him up and been like, I told him about this exact situation where I'm like, I'm just fucking up at work, dude. I'm just having a rough go. Like it, it it wasn't so much that I was upset with them. I wasn't upset with them at all. I was upset with myself. I'm like, God, like I'm not used to sucking.

SPEAKER_01: 2:04:03

Yeah, so there's there's there's a verse, scriptural verse, it says iron sharpens iron. Iron sharpens iron. So that and that's a great metaphor, but you've again prefrontal cortexes. When iron is sharpening iron, it's it's a violent process. It's an aggressive, uncomfortable process. One of the irons, one of the one of the surfaces is stronger and more refined than the other. So what it's doing when it strikes the other iron is it's taking away the weak spots. Yeah, it's it's it's shaving off the parts that are not efficient for that iron.

SPEAKER_10: 2:04:36

Yep.

SPEAKER_01: 2:04:36

And they're both affected.

SPEAKER_10: 2:04:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:04:39

So iron sharpening iron is not it's not supposed to be comfortable.

SPEAKER_10: 2:04:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:04:44

Correction is correction is not criticism. Correction is correction.

SPEAKER_10: 2:04:48

Right.

SPEAKER_01: 2:04:48

And that's and that's a big that's a big thing that helps me with humility. If somebody's correcting me, that's one thing. If they're just criticizing, hey, I just take it and I move along. So there was a great comment on here about autism.

SPEAKER_06: 2:04:59

Um uh George, are you teaching on how to deal with autism spectrum?

SPEAKER_01: 2:05:04

Not specifically, but um, I'm trying to get myself very well educated. I have a family member who is autistic. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 2:05:11

My oldest daughter.

SPEAKER_01: 2:05:12

And is very um, we we're running across that and interacting with autistic people, yeah, adults as well, in in law enforcement, and it's a whole different ballgame.

SPEAKER_06: 2:05:21

It is I I showed a really good video. Um, they're in like a Starbucks or something, and right away, signs were there. Yeah, and the cops sits down and they end up manhandling him and taking him out.

SPEAKER_01: 2:05:33

I'm just like, come on, guys. Yeah, like that's that's those signs. There's a snake on the trail sign. Don't don't emotionally invest in this kid not understanding what you're trying to get them to do.

SPEAKER_06: 2:05:44

And to him, the kid, he just kept seeing stuck on repeat. He's like, I didn't do anything wrong. I didn't do anything wrong. He didn't, they just wanted him gone. Right. It was a it was a big issue. So um Brand R86 said, Um training seems to provide a pure form of officer control to any scenario. This leads me to believe that they may not be taught that they may be in a no-win scenario because their ego is in control. I'm processing that. Give me a second. Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 2:06:14

So Okay, he I think he follows it up. Oh, I'm sorry. If officers are taught they could be in a no-win scenario, it may help check their ego in situations.

SPEAKER_06: 2:06:22

Or help us screen them. That's actually a good fucking idea.

SPEAKER_01: 2:06:24

I don't, I don't, I don't disagree with that at all.

SPEAKER_06: 2:06:27

I like that.

SPEAKER_01: 2:06:27

The Kobayashi Maru test for hiring. For hiring. Yeah. Instead of civil service.

SPEAKER_06: 2:06:33

That's fucking brilliant. I really like that, George. You may be in a you're the only one in the position for ours. Uh maybe you need to figure something out. If we put him, okay, so let's let's kind of brainstorm that real quick. If you put them in a situation, and banning, chime in too. Um put them in a no-win situation. Or a perceived a perceived no-win situation, um, where really the probably the proper answer is just walk away.

unknown: 2:06:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 2:06:59

Oh, this is a non-law enforcement issue. And and you've got a upset complainant that knows this is wrong, this is morally illegal, and you've got a suspect that knows their rights.

SPEAKER_01: 2:07:13

Yeah. Now they get those scenarios in scenario training patrol procedures. And and there are several that they have to come to the conclusion of this is a civil matter, and I have no authority to do anything here. True. So they they learn the consequences of making a bad arrest. Ah, gotcha. But as far as sorting, character sorting.

unknown: 2:07:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 2:07:32

Um, and then he said, like some civilians may know the law better than the officer at the time during the encounters. I I won't lie. I have had times where somebody spouted off a law to me, especially sovereign citizens, and they got me second guessed. I'm like, what? I haven't heard of that. And then I'll be like, you know what? I'm gonna go check. Let me check. Again, that goes into experience and stuff like that. But I have found more oftentimes than not dealing with the sovereign citizens, like I go check out their stuff, and I'm like, oh, this is not even a thing. Yeah, you're just making up some weird ass law.

SPEAKER_01: 2:08:06

They're they're throwing it at them while the season sticks.

SPEAKER_06: 2:08:09

Um eye of the night, iron sharpening, iron takes down those points to that stand proud. Stick up, whether flattening down or shaving off, much like life, you either bring back into the acceptable range or you remove them.

SPEAKER_01: 2:08:23

Absolutely. I like that. Pride's a problem. Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 2:08:25

Wade Lucero said, Mr. B's in the zone.

SPEAKER_05: 2:08:29

Throw up Mr. Billfold's.

SPEAKER_06: 2:08:30

Uh yeah, he said, I will fight with Eric and Banning enough, though. I see the ship as sinking. I do not need the possibility of a win to chew the same dirt and fight next to the men I see as brothers. I like that. God, he's such a good dude.

SPEAKER_01: 2:08:44

Yeah, I like that. Yeah. I also like the expression someone came up with says you don't have to like somebody to love them.

SPEAKER_06: 2:08:50

Right. Yeah, there's a uh um it's an old play um that they would show in Flint quite a bit, but there's this there's this particular scene that I've actually seen, like Denzel Washington. I've seen um James Earl Jones play this role where they're the dad and uh they're talking to their son, and the son's very upset because it seems like the dad doesn't like them. He's like, Oh, gotta like you. He's like, food, clothing, a roof over your head. He's like, he's like, if that doesn't show you that I love you, you know, like that that's the point of the conversation. Um great, great stuff.

SPEAKER_01: 2:09:27

Okay, so let's uh so some more tools, uh, being deliberate with your self-awareness, being okay with telling yourself I was emotional about that, um, doing a tactical debrief by yourself, yeah, play it back. You know, oh how to handle that call. Yeah, when he said that to me, that's what that's when I turned. That's when I got pissed.

SPEAKER_06: 2:09:43

Yeah. Officers need to do. I I recommend most calls, the majority of calls, you're never gonna handle alone. You shouldn't handle alone unless you're a deputy out on sticks, like banning was. But either way, you can do it by yourself or you can do it with the person you handle the call with. Go, all right, how'd that go? Bro, you you got a little wrapped up. Yeah, like when they said this, I saw it trigger you. Like, yeah, that's why I stepped in.

SPEAKER_01: 2:10:08

Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 2:10:08

Um, and that's something that we need to do more often as cops. Um, banning, how often, and this is a an issue that I see quite often, is you'll get a younger, much younger officer that's on a call with a more senior guy, and you'll see the more senior guy maybe get a little wrapped up in something, and the younger officer won't say shit.

SPEAKER_05: 2:10:27

And that's that's that's a huge problem across the country. I mean, we can we can pull those videos all day long. However, I'm starting to see a switch. I started to see a switch when I was in. I remember the first time I pulled a sergeant out of a doorway uh working in a larger agency down in the Metroplex of what was going to happen to me. But I knew that there was a line being crossed. And I knew that I took an oath, and it's not to the sergeant standing in the door that freaking signs off of my timesheet, it's to the people that were serving in that living room that he was becoming unglued on. And once I realized probable cause did not exist and we were done, I had to suck that up, grab the back of that dude's duty belt with the three stripes on, and pull him down and take the consequences as they came. Did not do anything in front of the public with him. I'm like, sir, got it from here, meet you in your car in five. And I just gave him a look that I that I give people that they understand that I'm serious. And uh I finished that conversation and we let them go. They got his goat. I've been a supervisor and I've almost had my goat hat, and I've trained guys underneath me that were able to see that and call me out on it. You've got to be a man enough if somebody's got your goat, if you've got a good good person there and they let you know it doesn't matter what the hell's on their sleeve or on their collar. Yep. They're looking out for the interest of the people that we took an oath to, and that's where you need to check yourself. Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 2:11:54

Period.

SPEAKER_05: 2:11:55

But it's not happening too much.

SPEAKER_06: 2:11:57

Got a good question by Gigi. She said, um, is there an addiction to being right in policing today? Uh yeah. I and I don't even necessarily think it's um to being right. Uh something that George and I can definitely talk about in policing is that there's a culture of having you control your scene. Yeah. That is something that we push on them that I don't know that we do a good enough job to understand between controlling your scene and then overstepping into that emotional side of being right. And I think we're fine-tuning that today. We're trying to.

SPEAKER_01: 2:12:35

Yeah. And I think part of it is also understanding that it's an illusion of control. Right. And uh this chasing the rabbit, um, telling the recruits to monitor the potential threats and deal with the actual in patrol procedures. Uh, the example being you have a uh a suspect that needs to be arrested who could potentially be armed, but you have a loud crowd in the background. A lot of the recruits will focus their attempts on controlling the crowd.

SPEAKER_10: 2:13:01

The crowd, yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:13:02

And what I'll tell them is that unless you bring in horses, riot gear, outside agencies, you're not gonna control that crowd.

SPEAKER_06: 2:13:10

You're outnumbered, you're outgunned, so to speak.

SPEAKER_01: 2:13:13

So what you can do is monitor that potential as you deal with the actual, because you're you're not gonna have control un unless there's force involved. And the goal is to I don't want to use the word manipulate, but um convince the the person you're having the interaction with that the logical progression of your interaction should be this.

SPEAKER_10: 2:13:39

Yep.

SPEAKER_01: 2:13:40

And if you can if you can maintain your emotional regulation and they can maintain their emotional regulation, you can get there.

SPEAKER_06: 2:13:48

Yeah, yep. Um, agreed. Let's uh we are we are pretty close to getting through all these, so I want to make sure we get through the rest.

SPEAKER_01: 2:13:56

The the rest is just some tips, you know, things that we all know. Exercising, uh it teaches you discipline. You're learning uh discipline through consistency, practicing when then visualization. I used to be real big on if this happens, then I'll do that. But I don't want it to be if I want it to be when this happens because it it's it's far more probable that the crazy thing that you can imagine will actually help happen in your career at some point.

SPEAKER_08: 2:14:21

Yep.

SPEAKER_07: 2:14:26

Anything on that?

SPEAKER_01: 2:14:29

Um let's see, active listening. That that yeah, we can chase that later.

SPEAKER_09: 2:14:38

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 2:14:39

In the thick of it, all right, breathing. Um breathing is always going to help you think. Yeah, okay. A lot of what we do um in the tactical arena involves regulating our breathing because it it puts us back into that prefrontal cortex, tactical breathing, there's all kinds of little tips and tricks, you know, research them on your own. Um, ensuring your personal safety is a big one because going back to that amygdala, if you can go back one screen.

SPEAKER_07: 2:15:03

Oh, I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_01: 2:15:04

So if you feel unsafe or there's something in the back of your mind telling you you're not going to operate rationally, your amygdala is taking over because it it's picking up something that you're refusing to acknowledge. So I came up with this little formula distance plus cover equals time. So if you have distance and cover, you have time to think about what you need to say, active listen, de-escalate, find a better position, call in resources, all of those things. And then the greater the time you have, the greater the survivability of that event. And the metaphor I use is crossing the street. If you go to cross the street and you look and there is a car 15 feet away and you decide to make that crossing, you do not have enough distance to survive that encounter. But if you recognize the car a hundred feet away, now you've just increased your survivability. So those little tips I I if you can recognize the emotion before it starts to take over, that's your distance and time or distance and cover.

SPEAKER_06: 2:16:03

Yeah, the moment they make that mama joke, you're like Right. Okay, this is something that gets me going.

SPEAKER_01: 2:16:08

Yeah. And then that old thing from uh that old 80s movie um about the bartender. Roadhouse? Roadhouse. Uh when you say, what if he says something about my mama? What if he says my mama's a horse? Is she? We know it. Yeah. So these these next internal dialogues, it's not personal. Say that to yourself. Yeah, that dude doesn't even know me. It's all business. He doesn't even know me. And he's pissed off because I'm walking him out of the bar. Yep. Don't, don't, they don't mean that. Don't take the bait. And if you really get to where you're recognizing you're starting to get hot, saying things to yourself like, is this worth my career?

SPEAKER_10: 2:16:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:16:46

Is it do I really care about this?

SPEAKER_10: 2:16:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:16:49

And um one of the things that you can you can start putting into your daily life is just making that internal dialogue inside your own mind. You're you're in line at Albertson's and someone cuts in front of you, or someone's rude to someone, or someone starts, you know, some kind of conflict with someone else, and it's verbal. Okay, what does law enforcement want to do? We've got to step in. That's a breach of the peace. I've got authority here. I'm gonna start, I'm gonna start controlling the situation. Is it worth it? Is the juice worth the squeezing? Is it juice worth the squeezing? Is it worth me physically, potentially physically hurting this person because they cut in line? Right. Yeah, and that's your picture. And that's in that's in here. That's a that's a heart set, mindset.

SPEAKER_06: 2:17:28

Yep. Um Wade Lucera said, you can't change cops stuck in a mode, learn how to control them. I will never be controlled again. Um it's not that I want to change cops that are stuck, it's that I want to help mold cops that are learning and emotionally open to learn. So um, what do I wonder when are you reading? Uh something that rhymes with screaming eagle shit. Yes. That's what he's saying. Yeah, that's what you're reading. So I guys, you don't know this, but one of uh the terms that are coined by the George Lopez is knock the screaming eagle shit out of it. Like that is his uh his motto.

SPEAKER_01: 2:18:10

Yeah, I I brought that question up to the great Eric Daigle at the Daigle Law Summit. And I said specifically, I use this phrasing, and my intent behind it is to demonstrate the need for um intent. So if you think about it, uh the the question was when you hit somebody, if I'm gonna use a close fist strike on someone to distract their focus from reaching for my gun or reaching back into the car, what happened? Does it do me any good from a law enforcement perspective to attain my goal if that punch does nothing to change their focus? Right. It's no good. I hit him for nothing. I didn't get anything. There was no juice to that squeeze. So I'm gonna squeeze. Why would I squeeze an orange softly to try to get as much juice out of it as I could? I gotta squeeze that juice, that orange hard to get the juice out, right? So to express that to recruits who don't have any kind of grounding on it, I say if you're gonna hit somebody, hit them hard.

SPEAKER_07: 2:19:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:19:08

I mean, you you you're going to go through the exact same administrative administrative administrative process for having hit them soft.

SPEAKER_06: 2:19:16

It's a use of force no matter what.

SPEAKER_01: 2:19:17

It's a use of force no matter what the law, yeah. So get what you need out of the the purpose of that strike. So I use the expression screaming eagle shit. And when I brought that up to Eric Daigle, uh, those of you who know who Eric Daigle is, you know who you, you know who he is. If you know, you know. Um and he said the problem with that is that you can't build context in court. They're gonna take what you say as what you say. So I have stopped saying that. Uh don't say it that way. What I do say now is if I'm going to strike someone with whether it's the taser, baton, pepper spray, or a close fist strike, I need to make it a purposeful, intentional um strike that's effective to get what I need out of that situation. Yeah. Somebody just brought up Mocos too.

SPEAKER_06: 2:20:03

I don't know what Mocos is.

SPEAKER_01: 2:20:05

Mocos is boogers. Ew. You hit them so hard the boogers come out. Ew. That's a boxing thing.

unknown: 2:20:11

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 2:20:12

All right. All right. Let's go. Okay. Um so the the rest of it is just a little more idealistic stuff. Which cop do you want to be? The the good examples of cops that are listening and being helpful and being kind and compassionate. Or the cop that's you know in your face and and I'm right, you're wrong, and that's the way it's gonna be. And me personally, I want to I want to be the cop that people walk away from and say, it's a cool cop. Yeah, and and I've had that happen. I mean, I've had uses of force when I was out in patrol, and on the way to jail, that that arrested person is saying, you know what, I I appreciate that it went the way that it did because I was in the wrong.

SPEAKER_10: 2:20:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:20:48

And I said, Those are always and they're eye-opening, they're eye-opening because I'm still rattled. I'm still like, I had to use force, my adrenal is still up, my emotions are still high. But here, this dude is a little more emotionally intelligent than me, and that that's helping me. Yeah, and that's a good thing, that's a good interaction, right? Yep. Um, not using force doesn't make you weak. You're not a chump for being a good talker. It's not a bad thing to to have a silver tongue.

SPEAKER_10: 2:21:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:21:16

Okay, it's always better to talk someone into the handcuffs than to force them. Um, and using force doesn't make you look tough. There are cops out there who want other cops to think that they're badasses. So they will they will use force. Yeah. Okay. And you have nothing to prove. Okay. You have nothing to prove to anybody.

SPEAKER_06: 2:21:34

One of the one of the funniest things that my guys told me when I worked over in our area, um, you know, here I am this big jujitsu background, you know, uh had a rep for screwing recruits up and in in training and all that stuff. And I go work in one of the most hands-on uh controlling environments that are out there. It's an entertainment district, and that's where George works, his bar stuff. And um I kept getting from my my officers, I thought I thought you knew something, Sarge. I thought you knew something. And I'm never having to use it because I'm talking to people. I'm I'm working it out so I don't have to.

SPEAKER_04: 2:22:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 2:22:15

And it's the thing that I try to show them. I'm like, I know how to use it so well that I know when I need to use it. Yep. And if I'm not using it, I don't need to. You will never see me use it because I don't mean to. I'm not trying to force to show you what I know.

SPEAKER_01: 2:22:31

I don't need to show you. Yeah, and and if anyone is that invested on whether or not I'm capable or not, we can hit the mats. Yes. If you really need to know, we can do that. Yeah. But you know, don't don't ask me to show you how badass I am on this guy who's just having a bad day. Yes. After being walked out of the bar. That doesn't prove anything.

SPEAKER_06: 2:22:48

No. And I tell them, I'm like, if you go in having the mindset that I've got front row tickets to the greatest show on earth, and all of this is just personal entertainment, that is how I like to do policing. That and that's why I was always on foot. I'm having conversations with people. I'm laughing and watching. People like, don't you get annoyed with drunks? Not at all. Don't bother me at all. They're fun to watch. Yeah. Because it's entertaining. Because I look at everything as personal entertainment. And when I do that, I have a good mindset into any situation. If it could be life or death to them, to me, I'm jovial about it. I'm having fun.

SPEAKER_01: 2:23:23

Well, the way I look at it, especially out in that entertainment district, is that person who's being a jackass right now, who's calling me every name in the book, is doing all he came out thinking he was just gonna have a good time and have a couple drinks. Yep. And and watch the game. Or hang out with his friends. He did not want to be out here to do this. Yep. And if I can keep that in perspective, it helps me, it helps me keep him human in my mind, which helps me stay human in mind. Yes. In mind. I agree. So there's a question on here. Um AB2C386.

SPEAKER_07: 2:23:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:23:52

How do I turn off the cop mentality when I'm home? I'm trying to be intentional at home, but I feel like I eat, breathe, and sleep cop life. Okay. I'm gonna teach you something, or I'm gonna explain something to you that is um it's a it's hard fought wisdom. Sean said, find a hobby. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, it's not wrong. I'm gonna tell you the the the no BS zone. We have entered Officer Lopez no BS zone. Okay. This job will forget about you the day you retire. Tomorrow. Yeah, the day you retire. You are gone. Okay. And you will carry this job to your to your dying day. So you have to be the one to decide. You have to you have to internally decide. I am not just a cop. Yeah a cop is what I do.

SPEAKER_07: 2:24:42

It's not who I am.

SPEAKER_01: 2:24:43

I'm I'm a husband, I'm a father, I'm I'm a dad, a friend, uh a mentor, whatever. Anything. Find hobbies, exercise, all of those things. But you've you've got to understand that this is just the job, and it will it will eat you up. It will if you if you stay in that cop mentality. So um my only advice in a practical sense, it find some friends that are not cops. Hang out with people that have no concept of being a cop and are okay with talking about something other than what was the craziest thing you've seen as a cop. Yes. Because that's just gonna hook you right in. Triggered. Okay.

SPEAKER_10: 2:25:18

Yep.

SPEAKER_01: 2:25:19

Um, and you know, church, hobbies, exercise, martial arts, all those things, any kind of hobby.

SPEAKER_06: 2:25:26

Yeah. I one of the things that I recommend to people is find if you were to lose your job tomorrow, what interests you? If you were to lose your job tomorrow, figure out what interests you. Um, I had no idea that what I'm doing now interested me. I I just wanted to know that I could still continue to help people if I were to lose this job. And that's how I developed what I'm doing now. Yes, it is related to the job, but it's a different way to help. Um, so that's that's kind of how I look at that. Um, looking in the in the chats, I just want to point out uh San Joaquin Valley Transparencies in the house. He said, Hey guys. Um, so if you guys didn't check out that last uh live stream that we had, we had him on here. He's uh one of the OG First Amendment auditors. Okay, um, it was a great episode. Um a lot of a lot of cool people there. Bearded Tim finally joining in here. Um, very cool. But um guys, I want we're not done yet, but I do want to make it a point. The class is over. We went through the whole course. Please, please, I know for a fact I'm not here to change the civilian mindset about policing. That's not that wasn't our point. My point being, I want to show you that cops are out here trying to fix issues we see. George created this class. He saw an issue. One of the ways he saw the issue is through our show. So in doing that, what we are doing is working in a way. I I look, it may not be the scale that you were hoping for, but it's working to the point where he changed it, created a class, and now it is uh for one of the 12 largest departments in the nation, and it is pushing out to recruits every time they go through. And I'm hoping that you guys, anytime you see what you may consider an ego issue at a department, just send them to this episode because it's going to be on our YouTube channel now forever. And they just got the same exact class, minus showing all the slides. Right. I feel like you got a more interactive, yeah, friendly conversation that I think people will be more accepted or susceptible to indoctrinating in what they do. So I'm hoping that that that works out for you guys. Um A1Bs2 said, uh, thank you guys. One of the best podcasts out there. Oh I appreciate that. Thank you very much. Um Sebulus Maximus, uh, which is one of the funnest names ever. He said, Welcome back. He said, I'm back.

SPEAKER_01: 2:27:57

Um it needs to be sent to departments everywhere.

SPEAKER_06: 2:28:00

Yep. Freedom Keys. Uh free's another one that's uh fair regular on here. Um, but uh thank you, Sean. I'll hit up my local BJJ Gym. Hell yeah. Uh love my tactical ground hugs.

SPEAKER_01: 2:28:13

Boxing. Boxing.

SPEAKER_06: 2:28:15

Boxing.

SPEAKER_01: 2:28:15

I think I've been nothing humbles you faster than getting punched in the mouth.

SPEAKER_06: 2:28:19

That's true. That is true.

SPEAKER_05: 2:28:21

Guns and hoses for one year. Boy, that humbled the shit out of me.

SPEAKER_06: 2:28:24

So there's there's two things that um George and I can really speak to when it comes to recruit training is um the guys that go, well, once I see red, like you get a lot of recruits that just they think that they can they can best somebody because they're just gonna rage out. Well, that doesn't work. Um, and we have plenty of shit. We got one guy that was a Marine Corps boxer, could have been a pro boxer. Um, we've got black belt in jujitsu, we've got judo practitioners, all sorts of things. But we make you do a three-minute round on the ground so you see just how vulnerable you are on your back um or face down or what however we want to put you. Um, and then uh we put you in the ring for what's the round?

SPEAKER_01: 2:29:10

It's a it's about a three-minute round.

SPEAKER_06: 2:29:11

A three-minute round.

SPEAKER_01: 2:29:12

It really does depend on how much that recruit gets after it.

SPEAKER_06: 2:29:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:29:16

Because if they're just running and ducking, that it'll be a longer experience.

SPEAKER_06: 2:29:20

Yeah, it it will be a long day for you if you choose kind of the uh if you think you're going to get out of it. It's not that I think they're being cowards, it's not that I think they I just think they think they can survive it, and that's not what we're trying to see. We're trying to see that mentality to push forward in the face of danger.

SPEAKER_01: 2:29:36

We're looking at the character, character Kobayashi Maru.

SPEAKER_06: 2:29:38

It is the Kobayashi Maru. Yeah, you're definitely going through that shit.

SPEAKER_01: 2:29:42

Mr. Billfold, I appreciate the kickboxing training. I'm a Muay Thai guy. Love it.

SPEAKER_06: 2:29:47

Yeah, Muay Thai is yeah, that's some the shit. Um actually, George and one of our other friends, uh his academy mate, Buck Wheeler, they're the ones that changed my mind on boxing. And then I got really into boxing for quite a while. And um, I haven't admittedly hit the bag in a little over a year. Uh I need to get back to it, but you know how it is. You go in stents of things and yeah, but you're you're making that big money now.

SPEAKER_01: 2:30:11

Yeah. Sergeant money, yeah. That's true. I am sitting sitting back there. I'm in the drop. I'm just coasting.

SPEAKER_06: 2:30:19

True. That's true. Yeah, George can be, he can leave anytime he wants, guys. Um Sean uh said, yeah, he knocked me out standing up in the academy, the marine boxer. Yeah, Eric Canales. I know exactly who he's talking about. Um, he could have been a pro boxer, y'all.

SPEAKER_01: 2:30:35

Easily, easily, easily, and we have a couple of pro boxers too, and and quite a few pro card holding MMA fighters.

SPEAKER_06: 2:30:43

The hardest I ever been hit by anybody in my life was a little 145-pound uh towns. And I was in a red man suit, y'all. He hit me so damn hard. I had to, I was like, I'm done for the day. Like he rung my bell through a thick ass padded helmet. Just fucked me up. Um, 145 pounds. I was probably 180 at the time. Um I'm probably 195 right now, but yeah, I was I was not a small dude. But um, Mr. Billfold, what was that, Benny?

SPEAKER_05: 2:31:17

That's my calf. But go ahead.

SPEAKER_06: 2:31:19

Um, Mr. Billfold said, I'm 6'2 with a 72-inch reach. I was always getting beat down by the tall, long guys, but I can eat a punch like Pac-Man.

SPEAKER_01: 2:31:30

Oh shit. Well, a wise man once said, it's not how hard you can hit, it's how hard you can get hit and just keep moving forward.

SPEAKER_07: 2:31:38

Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 2:31:39

Love it. Um, George, do you got any? I mean, we still got time. I don't know how much time you got, but is there anything you want to just that last little line here that I put on the slide.

SPEAKER_01: 2:31:49

Humility and self-control are superpowers. Okay, everyone is wrapped up on I I've got to look tough. I want to look like the badass. I want to look like I'm in control of the situation. I want my peers to admire me and to respect me. But being that calm, cool, still, unrattled a bull guy in the craziest situations, that's the that's the guy.

SPEAKER_10: 2:32:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:32:14

Look, look for the guy who's being quiet and assessing and figuring things out and doing things in a way that truly benefit the purpose that you're there.

SPEAKER_10: 2:32:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:32:24

Okay. Whatever whatever the call details are, whatever it is. Am I really working towards solving that problem and not investing time, effort, or force into satisfying my id. I like that.

SPEAKER_07: 2:32:39

Thanks. I like that.

SPEAKER_06: 2:32:41

Um somebody said Buck Wheeler knocked the screaming eagle shit out of me. Tasted blood all day in class. Mr. Billfold said, I like George. I can sense good energy. I see why y'all's department is so. Squared away compared to the rest of Texas.

SPEAKER_01: 2:32:57

That's probably the best compliment I could have gotten.

SPEAKER_06: 2:33:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:33:00

Ever. Yeah. I really appreciate that.

SPEAKER_06: 2:33:02

Yeah. Brand R86 said famous words. I didn't know how many it would take to kick my ass, but I knew how many they were going to use. Get George on Joe Rogan. Fuck it. Hey, fuckers, I want to be on Joe Rogan too. He's the whole reason I started a podcast. No, you're right. Honestly, one of the things that I would like to do, y'all, is have George more implemented when we start getting some of these training shows that we want to do. Because you guys know it's more than just the podcast. We've got other things. We're doing a tech and order show with through the DTV stuff. We're trying to talk about the latest and greatest technologies that are out there. I want to talk about the latest and greatest training and stuff like that and how to break down training. So a guy like George could look at a class and be like, all right, I see some gaps here. Like we're not addressing this. Or there's some really good stuff here. We could we could, you know, push this part out.

SPEAKER_01: 2:33:58

Or we're over-addressing this. Yeah. I mean, there's also this concept of majoring on the minors. Yes. Which is um over specificity. Yeah. Getting into it.

SPEAKER_06: 2:34:07

Too many, getting a big bite of steak rather than having small sips of soup. Yeah. You want to talk about that when we're okay.

SPEAKER_01: 2:34:14

So you you might just as a side note before we chase any more rabbits, um, we I've kind of restructured a little bit how we do the CT training.

SPEAKER_08: 2:34:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_01: 2:34:24

Because they they were taking some time that they needed to move around for Bpox stuff and whatnot. And um, so they've asked us to trim down how we train in CT. And I had been looking at it for years on how we train. We train in a very basic martial arts format. Drill, drill, drill, drill, you know, armbar, armbar, arm bar, whatever. Yeah. So to me, what I equated that to is okay, today, this week, we're gonna learn how to ride a bike. Okay, Monday, I'm gonna teach you how to pedal. Tuesday, I'm gonna teach you how to steer. Wednesday, I'm gonna teach you how to hit the brakes. Thursday, I'm gonna let you practice going downhill as fast as you can because you've got all the elements of bike riding, just put them together. Right. And that that's not that's not right, yeah. That's like giving somebody a scattered piece of puzzle pieces without showing them the picture at the end that it's supposed to look like. That would take forever. Okay. So what we're doing now is instead of replicating an arm bar takedown or a strike or this or that, we're we're replicating arrest events, like a totally compliant person. How would that look? Looks like this. And then you rep out that mini scenario.

SPEAKER_10: 2:35:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01: 2:35:31

So they're getting basically of red man one, two, three every day. Ah and over.

SPEAKER_06: 2:35:38

Getting more reps with stuff that they're going to actually apply.

SPEAKER_01: 2:35:41

With a complete scenario that ends in a handcuffed position and that person articulating everything. And I've also implemented um, well, I that I put it in there. I don't know if they do it on the daily, but something that I call the four C's to help officers. Four C's is camera, communicate, contact, and control. So first thing I want to do is turn on my camera, just make it a habit. Yeah. I'm recording this interaction, everything is going on, and then I'm communicating exactly what needs to happen. You are under arrest, or you are detained, or you are free to leave at any time if you don't want to talk to me. Whatever, whatever my legal authority is, I'm communicating that right to the channel. Educating as we go. Right? Yeah. Yeah. That's really what it is.

SPEAKER_06: 2:36:24

You break it down, you're educating as you go. And I think that's the best way to do policing.

SPEAKER_01: 2:36:27

And I'm articulating for my witness, this is this is what's happening. This person is being detained for this, or this person is free to leave for this, or they're under arrest for this, whatever. And then contact is you how much force is necessary force. And there was a great example, a guy named Lon Bartell, he works for Virtue now, but he's he's one of the four science guys. He had this great example about the difference between necessary force and appropriate force. Okay, how much force does it take to lift this can off this table? Specifically, you you don't know until you go to lift it because it could be full, it could be empty. It could be full, it could be empty, it could be nailed to the table. There could be all kinds of variables that require more force. Right. So you don't know how much force is necessary until you get there and understand the level of resistance you're getting. So the way Bob Sutherland would put it, yeah, he would say, Sometimes you just got to grab somebody and see what happens. Because that person might be all talk, and you grab a hold of them and then they're compliant.

SPEAKER_06: 2:37:30

Completely compliant.

SPEAKER_01: 2:37:31

And now it's time for your emotional regulation to step in and say, Okay, this is what I've got.

SPEAKER_06: 2:37:35

I don't care what you say, I care what you're doing. That's what I try to tell people all the time. I don't care what you say.

SPEAKER_01: 2:37:40

So humility and self-control are superpowers for cops. I like it.

SPEAKER_06: 2:37:44

Um, Mr. Billfold said, here's a better compliment, George. You and Eric actually make me feel like your area is safe to live and be free in. We shall see how your new chief works out. Um Sean said, guys, it was awesome getting to hang out a little and receive some knowledge, but it's time to get some rest. Stay safe, brothers and sisters. Appreciate it, brother. Thank you, sir. You you actually know who that is. Sean Slatlik. We trained him. We did. Yep. Air Force guy. Yeah. Um, I'm going back because I saw Brandar said, Um, famous words. I didn't know how many it would take to kick my oh wait, I already read that part. He said something else. Freeman said, George, I really appreciate the really appreciate the work you put into training. I know it was a lot of work, but just know we thank you. Um, Brandar said, I was called here for service. Give me your ID. I need to know who I'm talking with because I don't know you. And I I promise you, at the academy where he's teaching, um, we absolutely work over when and when you can't ID somebody. Right.

SPEAKER_01: 2:38:53

Um, we don't do that ask, tell, make stuff.

SPEAKER_06: 2:38:56

No, no, it's not, uh, it's a little different. Brand R86 drop five dollars. Thank you, sir. He said, Does the academy teach the difference between a call for service versus a violation of law? Getting the ID for a non-crime seems to be a standard.

SPEAKER_01: 2:39:11

So uh we do teach. And um the baseline for our teaching on that is it it never hurts to ask. The way I say it is you can ask anybody anything, but they can tell you to fuck off. And if they tell you to fuck off and you don't have authority, off you must fuck. Yep.

SPEAKER_06: 2:39:27

Off you must fuck. I like that. Um, and I've told that to them, and a lot of people on here, they're not a big fan of even asking. They they don't like that.

SPEAKER_05: 2:39:37

Well, this is the problem across the the globe and what we're seeing. And ever since I've joined Eric on this podcast, I'm even seeing it more with the videos that are being provided to me. But dispatch sending you somewhere does not give you legal reason. Right. Yeah, that is a big one. We see it all the time. You you, as the licensed peace officer by your state, when you get on scene, you are the one that determines if I have a legal reason to be here or not. And if you don't, vominose. Get the fuck out of town, man.

SPEAKER_06: 2:40:06

I think that's one of the big things that we're missing in training, is and I'm not saying with us, because I know we train it, but when officers get into the scene, they want to handle the details. They don't want to handle the offense. Do I have an offense? That's all I'm thinking of when I arrive on scene. If I'm getting a call, we'll use a First Amendment order because it seems to be the most popular one lately. Is do I have an offense? Okay. How do I figure out if I got an offense? I can sit back and observe the person that is alleged to be my suspect. All right, I don't see an offense. Let me get a hold of my complainant. What did you see? Well, I saw him out there filming people at the bank. Where was he at? Was he on the sidewalk the whole time? Yeah, he was out there on the sidewalk. Did he ever come out of the property? Did he ever go inside? No, he didn't. Okay. I'm working through to see if there's a crime here that even they're not aware of. Okay. Well, ma'am, you're not um everything that you're telling me, he is legally allowed to do. Now it's education time. Um, I know that it seemed like it's an invasion of privacy. I can understand why you may feel that way. Nobody wants their personal information and stuff like that maybe taken. I was like, but that's that security in public is on you. It's not on that person. So they are allowed to film, they're allowed to do that stuff. I don't ever have to make contact with them. I don't have to make contact with the auditor if I do things the right way. Unless they're able to articulate something that I'm like, I need to investigate that part. They said that he went inside that car. Okay, let me go talk to him. Hey, bro, they said you went inside that car. Were you out here filming all your stuff? Yeah, I was out filming. Okay, I I know how the First Amendment thing works. Um, if if you don't mind, you don't have to show me because I don't have a legal right to it. But if you don't mind showing me uh your video, just to she said you went inside that car. No, I went outside and I filmed everything from the outside. Do you mind showing that to me? Yeah, cool. Awesome. All right, that's all I need to see. And if he tells me fuck off, I'm like, all right. You can't force it. I can't. You can't make him. No. I was like, all right, well, let me annotate what both sides told me, and and that's it.

SPEAKER_01: 2:42:01

Yeah, that's part of the illusion of control.

SPEAKER_06: 2:42:02

Yeah. Because I I need to have an offense. If I don't have an offense, and most, I would say 99% of the time when you go to that person and be like, all right, are you willing to sign as a sworn witness statement? You're like, no. Yeah. They're like, no, I'm not doing that. So um I do want to give a shout out. Marine Blood is reminding me. Uh, hey, are you guys uh a cop that wants to do better? You want to be a better detective, you want to do all that stuff, and you can't afford to have more cops, check out paragraphine.io. Uh, I promise you, if you get their program, you will improve your policing. So uh shout out to them. Shout out to Ghost Patch Customs. Let me show my my flex badge, yeah. Uh uh Banning's showing his as well. It looks metal. I know it looks metal, but it is not. It's actually bendable, and uh, you can put it right on your police vest. Um, so or or whatever. You don't have to be a cop to get that stuff, guys. So ghostpatchcustoms.com. Um, but yeah, I'm going over to uh Brandar said it seems officers automatically think because they are there, an offense has already occurred, get the details. Um yeah, I agree. I I that in the problem videos that we see, I agree. Do I think that that's the majority of police work? No. I mean, we uh George can back me up on this. We see you're only seeing uh a fraction of the calls. There's I mean, just in our city alone, there's like one or two million calls a year. Yep. So if that was the majority, the the outrage the public would have would just be so so outlandish. I because I I just can't see it. Um, but is there a problem? Yeah. Uh everybody wants you to get in Discord, but I don't know what that is. So Discord is basically like um I had to learn to it. It's like uh you remember old AOL when you had chat rooms? Yeah, like it's kind of like that. Okay. A little bit. Um, we have a sp a spot in there. I can actually show it to you. Is do you want me in there so you can beat me up? Or or are there really free crayons? Uh so um I'm actually pulling it up right now for him, y'all. Um wherever it went.

SPEAKER_08: 2:44:16

Uh verifying Discord.

SPEAKER_06: 2:44:19

Where the hell is it?

SPEAKER_08: 2:44:21

There it goes.

SPEAKER_06: 2:44:22

Checking for updates. I'm gonna show them the Discord, but basically, George, I have an ask a cop question or ask a cop channel in there. Okay. So they probably would love if you could chime in on that portion.

SPEAKER_01: 2:44:34

Um is this like an app that I download?

SPEAKER_06: 2:44:38

Uh yeah, you can it's an app you can have on your phone. You can have uh on here. So here's our channel. So when I click on the channel, here's all the like sub channels of it. Um so here's our general chat, for instance. So I click on that, that's what we're looking at, and this is all the stuff everybody's talking about at the time. Um, you can go over to memes and fun things, and this is what everybody's looking at and putting in there. Um, but here's like the ask a cop question spot. So this would be a good spot. You come in, you can chat about that. We can actually give you your own link as well, where it's you know, George Lopez. And then people can specifically, so you see over here you got Eric, Banning, Matt Thornton, you got all these uh other cops and stuff that are part of the show. And you could literally just be you'd have your own thing and chime in from time to time. So um I might do that. Yeah. Well, guys, we have been going for two minutes, two hours and 45 minutes. So we are going to end this. Um, but uh I appreciate everybody, George. I really appreciate you taking the time to come on here. I think this was great. Um, everybody else, thank you for supporting the page tonight. Um, supporting the live stream. Thank you for the donations. We appreciate that. If you couldn't do it monetarily, we really just want your likes, follows, and subscribes because that really shows us that we're doing the right thing and you like what we're doing. Um, and everybody else, uh Mr. Bill Fold said, How did you take this long to get George on here, Eric? We've been we've been talking about it for years, have we not?

SPEAKER_01: 2:46:11

Yeah, since he started it.

SPEAKER_06: 2:46:12

Yeah, we've been talking. It's just a matter of getting George to get comfortable enough to come on here.

SPEAKER_01: 2:46:16

Not so much that. Hey, I'm a busy guy, man.

SPEAKER_06: 2:46:19

You're not busy. You're a grandpa. Grandpa aren't busy. Uh Wade Lucero said, Discord is more formal. You can cuss Eric and keep YouTube clean. I like it. But all right, everybody, Banny Keys, you're welcome. Banning, you got anything uh to end on?

SPEAKER_05: 2:46:37

I appreciate everybody tuning in tonight. Thank you, George, very much for blessing us with your presence, brother. Absolutely, man. Really appreciate it. Since the uh first day I met you. I texted Eric. I'm like, hey, I met this dude, and he had nothing but uh good things to say, and I can I can echo that 100%. Thanks. I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_01: 2:46:53

All right, brother. Yeah, any closing thoughts? Um if you're a cop and you're watching this, humility. Humility. Check your egos, watch your emotions. I mean, be safe, but at the same time, remember you you it's your job to be a cop. It's not who you are. You know, be a human being. I like it.

SPEAKER_06: 2:47:15

All right, guys. Everybody, have a good night.

SPEAKER_01: 2:47:17

Take it easy.