Miami Auditor Detention Breakdown

“Because I wanted to.”

That’s the explanation a Miami police officer gives when asked why he put two men in the back of his patrol car. What began as an exchange over blocking traffic escalated into demands for ID and handcuffs. Was this about enforcing the law, or an officer who couldn’t handle being challenged?

In this episode of Two Cops One Donut, active-duty police sergeant Erik Lavigne breaks down the encounter, questions the officer’s safety explanation, and examines the reported internal affairs findings. He also challenges what the edited footage leaves out, including part of the responding supervisor’s explanation.

The discussion gets into reasonable suspicion, Florida identification requirements, detention versus arrest, and what supervisors should do when someone wants to file a complaint. Erik shares a mistake from his own early career and explains why emotional control and constitutional training matter when an encounter turns confrontational.

You don’t have to like a First Amendment auditor’s approach to take their rights seriously. But where does protected criticism become actual interference, and what should happen when an officer crosses the line?

Listen to the breakdown and decide for yourself. Watch the episode on the Two Cops One Donut YouTube channel to see the footage discussed, and subscribe wherever you listen.

Transcript

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Disclaimer And Viewer Discretion

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hey everybody, welcome to Two Cops One Donut. I'm your host, Sergeant Eric Levine. Before we get started, here's a quick disclaimer. The views and opinions you're about to hear are those of the hosts and guests alone. They don't represent any police department, agency, sponsor, or employer. 2 Cops One Donut isn't responsible for anything said by guests or for any videos, clips, or content shown during the live stream. This show is intended for adult audiences only. We cover real incidents, we show graphic and sometimes disturbing footage, and we don't shy away from strong language or adult conversations. There may or may not also be alcohol involved. Viewer discretion is strongly advised. Everything you hear or see on the show is for entertainment and educational purposes. It is not legal advice and it's not tactical instruction. And it shouldn't be used for such. By continuing to watch, you're telling us that you understand, you accept all this. All right, now let's get into it.

SPEAKER_02 0:53

All

Setting Up The Miami Stop

SPEAKER_02 0:54

right, welcome back to Cops One Don't. I am your host, Sergeant Eric Levine, and we are going to talk about the Miami incident. I don't know if you guys saw that one. Uh you see a a cop, you see some auditors, cop leans over, pulls up, doesn't like the answer he gets from these auditors, and decides to pull them up and uh get them detained and demand ID and put them in the back of the car. One could make the legal argument that you might have considered yourself under arrest. Um all for what could potentially have been uh could have been an ego thing, could have been a legitimate law enforcement encounter. We don't have the full story from Miami, but I can I can tell you what I think just looking at it, but I don't want to lead off with the story just yet. I um we're gonna that's what we're gonna get into. Uh so if you guys haven't seen these, I've been trying to do these lives every day. Take about an hour, hour and a half, discuss whatever the topic, topics are, and uh the whole point is heavy, heavy community engagement. So I think that's one of the things that we foster very well here at Two Cops One Donut. If you are over on our Instagram page, please jump over to our YouTube page. Um, we do uh try to get most of your chat in. I cannot see everybody's chat uh all the time. So we are live on TikTok and Instagram, but you have a much better chance of me seeing your chat on YouTube. Um so we are trying to filter everybody over there, but I am looking at the chats right now. I see Chef Rockies over there. He says, uh, because in the back of the cop car you're 100% under arrest, why would anybody think any different? See? Um, a reasonable person uh may come to that conclusion. That's why it's very important. That's why I say, as a cop, like you need to tell people, hey, I'm putting these cuffs on you, but you're not under arrest. Look me in the eyes. Let me know you understand. Repeat after me, I'm not under arrest. Okay, I'm not under arrest. Cool. Like you have to go above and beyond. Because are there times where you do need to detain and you got to keep everybody kind of corralled because there's too many people? Yes. Do I think this situation I'm talking about is one of those? No. Um, but you'll see. You'll see. We'll get into it. I promise. Um, but I got to make my notifications and talk about everything that we got going on and do all that stuff. Uh, looking over at the chat and YouTube, uh, Trevor says, need to speed up this intro by two times. No, sir. I need to cover my ass. I need to see why. Trevor, the big difference between me and a lot of other um air quotes police uh channels and podcasts is I'm an active cop. Like I am not taking anything to risk where somebody's like, well, I didn't hear it. Oh, I thought they was given real legal, whatever it is, whatever reason they need to try to fire me, I'm not gonna give it to them. I'm gonna make sure you knew that there was a clear disclaimer at the beginning of the show. Uh so yes. Um yeah, all over this old video, uh, Matt talking. Is it an old video? I don't know. It's the first time I've ever seen it. So it could be an old one. Doesn't change, uh doesn't change if it's good or bad. Still still should be discussed. Maybe it didn't get enough attention, obviously, the first time. Matt's just getting mad because we're not covering one of his videos. Calling you out, Matt. HBO Matt in the house. Make sure you guys check out his channel. Uh HBO Matt's a good dude for uh Second Amendment rights. Full show and First Amendment. Um looking in oh, Will's back. What's up, Will? Ariel's in the house. What's going on, Ariel? Uh looking what is today? Today's September 9th. Okay. I had to double check. I know September 11th, right around the corner. Let us never forget. Uh, I know where I was at. I was on my way to college. I was this was my first semester, I guess, of college. Um, let me see here. I'll tell you how ignorant I was when 9-11 happened. How naive this young uh Mr. Levine was. When the first plane hit the towers, I was like, oh my god, air traffic controllers fucked. He led a plane right into a building. And when the second one hit, I said, Oh my god, this air traffic controller's drunk. Like, that's how stupid I was. I just, I just, everything was rainbows and lollipops for me, apparently. I but I remember that thought specifically. I was like, what an idiot. Air traffic controller's a moron. I blamed everything on the air traffic controller, poor guy. All right, let's uh let's get to the video, shall we?

Watching The Miami Clip

SPEAKER_02 5:53

I'm gonna I'm gonna pull this up. Um according to HBO Matt, it's an old one, but uh yeah, Trevor, we all know Dom's take on it. Yeah, Dom's take's a little too extreme for me. Um but let me share the screen. Where is it at? Here, share screen. Share. Okay, so I am pulling this up from the clean up miami underscore ragomonkey Instagram page. I want to give him credit. I don't know who actually recorded this, I don't know who the auditors are. Um, I don't even know for a fact that they are auditors. I just I'm assuming. So uh let me get these disclaimers out of the way. Uh, and we'll go from there. So I'm gonna hit play, we're gonna watch it all the way through, and then we'll discuss it.

SPEAKER_04 6:45

You're blocking traffic. Okay, we're gonna send it up since you're here. We're gonna send it. Okay, but I'm gonna send it to you. Since you're here, I wanna see both of you like this. What? I'm gonna come myself.

SPEAKER_03 7:26

What are you doing? What are you doing?

SPEAKER_06 7:33

What are you doing? What are you talking about? What's the climb? What's the climb? What are you doing? Okay, I have a question. Why did he throw us in the back seat?

SPEAKER_04 7:44

Because I'm a bullshit. It's very simple. It's very simple, very simple. Okay, okay, yes. So beat the wapu bit this. How I do my job is me. Are you so why did I put you? Why did I put you in the back of my cover? Why did I put you in the back of my cover? Because I wanted to. Why did you let us go? Because I wanted you. Why did you let us do?

SPEAKER_05 8:25

Why did you let us go? So you're you're telling us we we can't stand here? We can't stand this.

SPEAKER_06 8:39

What's the Miami?

SPEAKER_03 8:52

I just told you what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_05 9:33

This guy's like five foot two.

SPEAKER_02 9:37

All right, we're gonna pause that now. Okay,

Clipped Footage And First Reactions

SPEAKER_02 9:40

so you saw the whole thing there. Was it clipped? I wanna get the I wanna get the obvious shit out of the way. Was it clipped? Yeah, there was clipped. Um, not by me, but by whoever did this. So um I don't like that they clipped out when they were trying to make the the complaint because that lieutenant gave an explanation of something, and they didn't show that part. So I want to know what that explanation was. This is why I don't just jump right on automatically that this cop was out of pocket. Although we know there's a lot that was out of pocket on this. Don't get me wrong. Um Trevor, isn't that video pretty old? I don't know, I've never seen it, so I'm covering it. I don't care if it's old, Trevor. I don't know if it's old. Quit giving me shit. I saw it, it was going around the interwebs. It's it's you know, one of those bipolar videos. It must hit its peaks and then hit its valleys. I've never seen it, so I'm covering it. And we're gonna talk about it. So, in that, in that video, um, I I've tried to find information about it. I can't find anything. All I can find is just people putting clips out. And like I said, the the place that I got it from, that cleanup Miami guy, uh, he just posted it. So I don't know how old it is, to be honest. Um, but let's go into what we see. So I'm gonna give that caveat. Is there more to that video? Maybe. Obviously, it was clipped. This is part of the problem that people have with First Amendment auditors, is when they when they clip out the inconvenient parts. Um, I feel like they clipped out a very critical part of that. So that has my spidey senses up a little bit. However, I'm gonna go into what I can speak about with a certainty, is how the cop acted from the get-go.

Safety Tactics And Ego Triggers

SPEAKER_02 11:38

So what I first would want to know, was there a call? I would say no, there was no call. I think this cop was rolling by and saw them. Let's say there was a call. How do you react when you get a call for service? First, you want to observe behavior, whatever it is, right? This officer rolled up next to them and rolled the window down and leaned over. No safety concern, right? I I that this is me and my 20 years experience. Um is there a safety concern? No. Because if there was, you would have unassed that vehicle. You wouldn't have pulled up next to them, you would have pulled up before them and then got out of your vehicle. Or you would have rolled past them, got out of your vehicle, and walked back to them. You're never gonna pull up next to people. Um you shouldn't pull up next to people if there's a valid safety concern. So I'm gonna go off of a cop's playbook. My playbook, my 20 years playbook. I'm not gonna roll up next to a call, ever. Um I shouldn't say ever. Sometimes shit just happens right next to you, and there's nothing you can do. So let's say he was parked there. Okay, let's let's let's go down that line. He's parked there. He rolled his window down and still leaned over. Safety concern not there. So they gave him shit. They gave the cop shit. You're blocking traffic. Okay, like that's part of the job. He he may have a right to be there and block traffic, he may not. Who knows? But you, this is where I start talking about police ego. I told you guys before, at my where I work, we actually put on an ego class. So officers understand what ego is, how it um uh scientifically, because I'm not a scientist and I'm not a doctor, but how it scientifically and medically affects the brain, how you're how reasoning and logic, there's a you you think with a certain part of your brain, you're frontal lobe, and then when you start to think irrationally, emotionally, and you lose that logic and reasoning, it switches to a different part of your brain. So we actually give that class to our officers. This is a great example. This is a great video where it shows that that switch. He leaned over, he was trying to have a discussion with them. They challenged him, he wasn't prepared for that. That was an unmet expectation. And then he switches over to ego. So you see that switch on him. He's like, I want your IDs. Well, you don't what reason do you have to get their IDs? Legally speaking, at least I cannot speak for the state of Florida. Okay. This is in Florida. In Texas, where I'm at, I can't ID you unless you're under arrest or it's a lawful traffic sob. It's a secondary offense to fail to ID. So um, I'm sorry, one of

Florida Stop And ID Law

SPEAKER_02 14:32

my mods is actually texting me. Posted the whole link in the chat. Um, what chat, Tim? I don't know what you're talking about. Uh you gotta be a little more specific. Um legally speaking, uh we'll just fucking we'll look it up. I'll look it up right now. I want to see what Florida's um what is the mandatory? Mandatory ID laws in Florida. We'll see. I'm guessing it's probably pretty similar. Okay, you are legally required to identify yourself under these specific circumstances, consensual and counter. I would say this was not consensual, lawful detention or crimes under Florida, stop and risk law, stop and frisk law, air quotes, um, 901-151. Officers can briefly detain and demand ID if they have reasonable reasonable suspicion you are committing, have committed, or about to commit a crime. This is the part that a lot of people miss is they think that because they can detain you briefly, that they can automatically get ID. And it has to be with RAS. Reasonable, articulable suspicion of a crime. You didn't have one here. You did not have one here. So, um, Tim posted it in YouTube. I can't click links in YouTube, sir. Um I can't click links on Restream through that. Uh but my point being, um the lawful detention or crime, like one, was it a lawful detention? Let's get let's break that part down. I would say no. You you had nothing. They're on a sidewalk, a public sidewalk, they're talking to you consensually, and now you're detaining them for what? Because you asked for their ID and they told you no. So um the other part is a traffic stop. So we're pretty spot on here with that same law in Texas. Um, loitering or prowling under 8856.021. If you are lingering in a suspicious place for time, and an officer asks you to identify yourself, refusing to do so, could give them probable cause to arrest you. Now, I would say um that's not a suspicious place. They're on a main thoroughfare, a main road. Um and while doing oh, Roberto Ortiz just texted me. If you guys didn't see that episode, Roberto Ortiz is a badass uh Mexico cop that lost both his legs uh fighting cartel and fought his way back to getting his uh getting back on the job. But I'm letting him know I'm on a live stream right now. Uh he's probably gonna be like, oh my bad. So um so loitering and prowling isn't gonna fit, right? He's on a main thoroughfare. That is there's this not a suspicious place. He's on a public sidewalk. You know what he was doing. I I I'm I am 95% confident that they are First Amendment auditors, even though I don't have anything to prove that. Um, and then false identification. Giving a fake name or false identification to law enforcement officer is a first-degree misdemeanor punishable up to one year. So that is in Florida. Um, which this would not have applied because they didn't give them any name. They just said they're not gonna ID because they didn't have to. So there's that. Um I'm looking over at the chat, seeing what you guys got to say so far. Um, Rumble Ridge, Miami cop has nothing better to do. I a hundred percent agree with that. Why I would not have wasted my energy. I may have, I mean personally, anytime I've had an auditor come up to me, I make it an opportunity one for education and conversation because it's fun. Because sometimes you get the type of auditors I don't like. And even though I did think these guys were kind of funny at the end, I still don't like the like I love the guys that kill them with kindness type. I like that. It's just my style doesn't mean I'm not saying that that's more right than the other. That's not what I'm saying. Um Will said, I think when I saw a longer version, the cop was parked across the sidewalk and the auditors confronted him and hurt his ego. Okay, so they walked over and talked to him. Yeah, it that fits. That does fit. That that seems to be what we had. Um, I see. Uh Twitchy said, Mac, no politics here. Thank you. Yeah, Mac, we don't do politics, brother. We don't do politics or religion. You want to stay on topic with the police topics? Great. We'll do that. But we there's plenty of other platforms for politics. We're just not that. We are not a police echo chamber. We call out bad police work when we see it. That's what we're doing right now. Um, I, if you are new to the channel and you don't know who I am, I'm Sergeant Eric Levine. I am an active cop in I'll say North Texas. We don't ever say what department because I got to keep those separate. Um, I am also an active military member. I'm in the Air Force IMA reserves, if you're familiar with that, but we'll just say Air Force Reserves as a cop. Um I'm a security forces member out of the 802nd, represent the Legion. Um, shout out to the Legion. Uh and with that, um having those two law enforcement backgrounds, I also have a dual master's degree in criminology and criminal justice. Um, if you're one of those people that think college makes you a better cop, I have a college background. Um, I don't think that college makes you a better cop. I think having great social skills and emotional intelligence makes you an amazing cop. Um, if you can go, if you can have those two things alone and then go into police work and learn everything, like you you have a better head start than anybody else that does the job. Um, I I will till my dying day, say people that are in the sales, people that are um in retail, people that uh have any public face, servers, um, baristas, bartenders, all those. I think they make better cops than anybody out there. Um, a degree does not make you a better cop. Shit. We've seen cops with degrees get in trouble all the time. I think cops that lived a Boy Scout life growing up tend to make worse cops. If I'm gonna be honest with my opinion. So um, but yeah, uh Twitchy, she goes, Will it's my job. Twitchy, my mods are awesome. They they kick butt. So thank you, Twitchy. I appreciate you. Uh but um I didn't even see whatever it was she had to delete. So appreciate it. But let's get back to talking about this video. So we got into the legality of was it a safety concern, right? Could you articulate a safety concern? I would say no. You leaned over, you rolled the window down, you didn't get out of the vehicle. You only decided to get out of the vehicle once they told you no, they wouldn't want ID. And then when they told you they don't have an ID, now you're detaining them, putting them in cuffs, and putting them in the back. Of your car. Now let's go into reasonableness. Does a reasonable person believe they are under arrest if you're not going above and beyond to explain to them that they're detained and not under arrest? I would say a reasonable person is going to believe that they've been arrested. And I've seen that argument made in court. I've seen that argument win in court a lot. I've been on the losing end of that, where they no PC'd one of them like, nah, that dude thought he was arrested. You can, you, you shouldn't have asked him those questions. And I wasn't asking anything crazy, but I had a crazy party slash turn into a violent fight, not with the cops, with each other. So we get there and we're trying to break it all up and get everybody separated. Um, and I took one guy, cuffed him up, put him in the back of the car, and then realized there was a lot more people involved. So we cuffed up more people, sat them on the curb, and then they said the questions that I was asking the guy that was in the backseat was he he believed he was under arrest, and I didn't mirandize him or do any of that. So they no PC'd that one. That was my fault. That was that was young, learning officer Levine, and I fucked that one up. It wasn't intentional. Uh, but you live and you learn. I is what it is. So that's where I learned you really got to use the language of making sure they understand that they are detained and they are not under arrest. So that's why I'm very clear now. If I arrest somebody, or if I detain someone, I'm like, hey, look at me. Let me know that you understand you're just detained. I need to make sure that you're recognizing that. And so uh that's what I do. Um but I would go into the argument on this one that they believed that they were possibly under arrest on this. That's a valid argument. Not saying that they did. Again, it was clipped. We can tell this video had been clipped. So that is that is something that we have to be honest about. What was that full conversation? So we went through Florida law, and I told you Texas law. In Texas law, I definitely wouldn't have had the ability to ID them because I didn't, they weren't under arrest and it wasn't a lawful traffic stop. Now, we've talked about this before. Do you have a right to film on a public sidewalk? Yes. So if that's what they were doing, they could do that. Did they have a lawful right to go up to the window of a police car and ask questions? I would say yes. Um and I like what Will said, Will Central Texas, he said, these were the confrontational type. I agree. Not my favorite style of auditors. I don't like that. I I love the I love the Jeff Grays out there. I love the, you know, um uh auto, the watchdog. I like, you know, auto's funny. Audio just holds

Auditor Styles And Public Rights

SPEAKER_02 24:54

a big ass sign that, you know, says shit's fucked up and stuff or whatever, whatever it is. Um and and auto's funny about the way he does it, but he's he's um he's a sleeper. That's the best way to put it. Like you underestimate the intelligence. It's not a slam on Otto. I promise. I love Otto. Not a slam on him, but you underestimate him. He his his appearance and his signs make you think that he's just an a dummy that doesn't know what he's talking about. But the dude is super well versed, knows his stuff. Um, I don't know what my point was. Oh, types of auditors. So I I like that style. Um, I like Long Island. I like I like his style. By the way, Long Island is debating with Jay Bandy. We've had both on the show. Uh Jay Bandy's a retired cop. His his website or his podcast, I don't know if he does a podcast. Yeah, I think he does. Or maybe he's just a talking head. Either way, he's got um Beyond the Thin Blue Line is the name of his. And then you've got Long Island Audit, which you guys know him, Sean Reyes, for his First Amendment auditing. Them two are gonna go head to head. I think is today Wednesday? It's supposed to be Wednesday, whatever today. Yeah, today. They're gonna go head to head. So make sure you guys check out their stuff. I think it's at 8 tonight. I think 8 p.m. Eastern. I could be wrong on that, but check out their. I'm I'm excited. I gotta work. So I'm gonna try to watch uh from my office. Um the best I can. I gotta work. So you know how it is. I'll just listen to it while I'm working. But uh I'm excited for that one because Bandy hates First Amendment orders. We've had the talk on, I shouldn't say he hates. He does, he strongly dislikes them. He strongly dislikes uh First Amendment orders. So I'm excited to see them too go head to head. Um, and that and this is why I like Sean. Sean doesn't shy away from that stuff. If you dislike them, he wants to know why. He's kind of like me. I will bring on anybody. I am like I said, we're not an echo chamber here. So um I just want to test out my testing chat. Test chat. Uh, I want to make sure we're still showing up on YouTube. We are on at least one of them. One disconnected. Son of a bitch. We keep having this problem. I noticed that the chat was uh where is their debate being streamed? Um, I believe it's gonna be on Bandy's site. I'm not a hundred percent sure. Um I am pulling up my YouTube channel real quick, guys. I just noticed that uh the chat is not at the top page. So give me one second. Um pop out chat. Okay, I got the chat up, so we're we're back. Uh let me oh, it is showing test. You guys can see it. That's good. It's just it wasn't popping up on my screen. So that's good. I'm glad we got that figured out. Um it's it's still showing that it's not. But HBO Match sending me videos while I'm live streaming. Oh, he got the longer one. It's by um oh, it it's on YouTube. Okay, it's 25 minutes long, so I'm not going to go through that while we're on the live, but I will watch that later because I really want to see what that conversation was with the lieutenant. Um he said this is an old video that he reposted. Okay, that makes sense. Yeah, it's about a year old. So it is about a year old. Thank you, Matt. I appreciate that, brother. Um cool. I see your chat too, Twitchy. Appreciate it. Uh, we're looking over at Instagram. Um, what is Bandy's site? I'm not familiar with him. Okay, I'll uh I'll give Bandy a little a little love here. I'm gonna pull up his page on Instagram for y'all. Um give me one second, because I I do want to bring attention to that debate. I think it'll be good. Um, Jay Bandy. Bandy is a friend of the show. Maybe I gotta type in um beyond. Yeah, there we go. Okay, I'm gonna share the page. Share the screen. There we go. Oh, my dog just they're fighting in the backyard, and I just felt them bump against the studio. Okay, here is Jay. Um, here's his channel. So let me, I'm gonna play the video.

SPEAKER_00 29:43

Alright, guys, this week, Wednesday, September 9th at 8 p.m., I will be debating Long Island audit Sean Reyes. If you don't know, I'm a retired cop. Sean is clearly not very pro-cop, not very pro-government, which is fine, because if you've watched my content, I'm not necessarily pro-government myself, but I do have respect for law enforcement, and I do believe there are good cops, but I also believe there are bad ones, which is why, if you actually look at my content, I expose who needs to be exposed, okay? But I also have an opinion on these auditors as well. You can go watch the videos about them that I've made, and catch up on how I feel about that. But we'll go pretty in-depth in this uh debate. We're gonna have a moderator, and if you want to ask questions, you can comment below, ask some questions that you want me to ask him, or you can ask questions during the live. And if you're gonna do that, I suggest doing it on the Instagram because it's hard for me to watch every page, and I'll be mostly focusing on the comments that come through the Instagram. So stay tuned for that. Wednesday, September 9th at 8 p.m. All right, guys. This week, Wednesday, September 9th.

SPEAKER_02 30:54

There we go. Um actually, all right, guys. I'm gonna pause this. It says we'll be going live with Long Island Audit for face-to-face debate. Um he said it's gonna be on Instagram and Facebook and TikTok. Uh, it doesn't say whose page. I'm going to assume it's gonna be his page, not Long Island's, but maybe he'll do both. Maybe they'll they'll dual stream somehow. So I'm gonna stop sharing. But this is his this is his Instagram page, uh Jay Bandy's. Um, like I said, I I'm not the type of guy that I have to agree with everybody or everything you say to be friends. Like there's stuff Izzo says, Dominic Izzo. I don't agree with him. Female cops, that's one of them. I I don't agree with him on that topic. On this particular one, uh, Dominic wants you to like publicly do something to this cop. I I don't agree with that. I don't think that that's the but that doesn't mean that I can't be friends with them and that I don't I don't recommend their stuff. I do. I think they make a lot of great points, and I think it's

Constitutional Training And Police Culture

SPEAKER_02 32:05

good to have people that you you differ with. Like me and we had Jay on and we actually talked about this subject. Not this particular arrest, but or issue, but we've talked about it. So it I think personally that First Amendment auditors are great. I think it's an amazing thing. Why do I think First Amendment auditors are great? One, it shows the beauty of our nation. We live in a country that is so free that you can hold your own government accountable uh by testing them and and and using your First Amendment right and seeing and putting them to the test to make sure they understand it. I think that's fair. Do I like the way everybody does it? Fuck no, I do not. I cannot stand some of these First Amendment auditors the way they do it. But the way that I feel uh does not trump their rights. So that is that's how I feel about that. I think I look at it, you guys know me. I'm an optimistic, idealistic person. That's just my nature. So when I see these auditors, I'm like, you know, I think it's pretty cool. I think that they have caused a lot of good training because when they first hit the scene, cops were grossly unprepared. We had no idea. I'm not gonna lie. I if they had hit me up when I was a rookie cop, I might have fallen down that same track because I didn't know. I did not know. Why did I not know? Because one, nobody's ever done that before. It's never really been a true test, which again, I think is a great thing. Um, so wouldn't have really got any training on that. And then two, how much training do cops really get on the constitution? How much training do cops get on something they swore an oath to? I swore an oath two times. The only reason I got really good constitutional training was from the military. I swore an oath to be a cop. And I now luckily, this is where I will give college some credit. I did have a constitutional class, cost constitutional law class, so that helped me out. But then I also got constitutional training in the military. And then I will say this about the military's culture. And anybody that's a veteran or is still in the military is going to tell you this. Whenever you fuck up, whenever you do something stupid, whenever you break something, you know, whether it's in training or whatever, you're going to get just berated for wasting taxpayers' money. It is beat into your head all the time. That ain't your Humvee, that's the taxpayer's Humvee. That ain't your helicopter, that's the taxpayer's helicopter. That ain't your pencil, that's a taxpayer's pencil. Police culture's not that way. Police culture, they don't talk about that. Not, at least not in my experience. If you're at a department that does, that's great. I think that that's a good mindset to have in the back of your mind all the time. Like, ah, this ain't my patrol car. It's a taxpayer's patrol car. Ah, this ain't my gun belt. This is a taxpayer's gun belt. You know, you should be thinking about that stuff all the time. It should always be in the back of your mind that this belongs to the taxpayer. I think that will help you stay constitutionally minded. And I think that is part of the problem in modern-day policing is we have shit training for the Constitution. We get a little block in the academy and then it's never touched again. The best that you'll get in police training for the Constitution is um case law updates. And that's only going to touch on possibly one or two parts of the Constitution if they even bother to mention it. So, I mean, you talk about Pennsylvania V Mems, you've got, you know, Fourth Amendment. We're talking about seizures, stuff like that. Uh, First Amendment stuff usually involves the auditors, freedom of religion, um, right to protest, all of these things. We have to understand the difference. You know, Third Amendment, which is my favorite. You don't have to quarter people. Um, if you know that one, that's that's bonus. Like there's there's certain amendments that cops need to know, and then there's ones that never going to affect them, like the third. But if you know it, that's cool. But that's that goes into my point about the training and and what we got. So looking over at the post, um verify for prosperity says, love this. Um, the only one I digest is delete laws. Chili is an asset. Yeah, attack cop cannot stand chili. Cannot. He tried to get on the show. I I was going to do it. I just I missed his message. So he had messaged me, and it was probably a couple hours later. I see it, and I'm like, oh, there it is. Like he messaged me. He said he's interested in being on the show. And he was really polite. I promise I won't do any of this stuff. I just want to get on, I want to talk with you about these topics. And I was like, oh, cool. Well, I didn't have time to respond, and I wanted to deal with it. So um, and try to figure out the details. Well, it was probably 10 minutes later from when I had checked the message. He must have saw that I saw the message or whatever, and he went on this big tirade. Oh, you just don't want me on because you're a tyrant and you're this, you're that. Like he did his thing that he does. I was like, holy shit. Okay, I can't have again, because I am an active cop, I have to be careful with what I have on the show because I can be fired. So this is a risk for me, even doing. I could be shit-canned for him getting on here and saying some out-of-pocket stuff. So I got to be careful with who I let on the show. Um, so I just I couldn't take that risk after he went off on me. I was like, I I and I told him, sorry, I can't. I just I gotta protect myself, no offense to you. Um one of those. And then he went off even more to the point like he wouldn't stop to the point where I don't block anybody. I had to block him. You guys know that. I don't like shit. My mods are in the house right now. They can they can go to our YouTube channel and probably tell you on one hand, maybe, maybe two hands, how many people we've actually blocked or I've blocked. I don't block people. Um, the only thing if you're a racist, if you're threatening violence to anybody, you know, this is the stuff that YouTube's just not going to allow anyway. That's that's gonna get you banned from the channel. And even then, I give you opportunities like apologize, whatever, you know, just man up or woman up if you're a woman. So we do that, but um, yeah, I do not understand what is going on with YouTube. It keeps screwing up. I I see in the live YouTube chat, I got it over here, but in Restream, it's not showing up um as often as it should be. And yeah, it's like my message is not going through right now. Crazy. Uh Twitchy said, uh, I post I posted in the Discord the horizontal stream. Uh it won't hyperlink the vertical. I don't, yeah, and I wonder what's going on with the vertical. Maybe I gotta fix something. I'm not sure. Um I wonder if there's something that I need to do. Balanced, normal, landscape, and portrait. Everything looks right. Might just be a restream issue, guys. I don't know for certain. Hopefully it fixes itself eventually. Um because the vertical is where we get a lot more viewers. I can tell you that for sure. So I guess it is what it is. Let me try over here and test. Yeah, I can type immediately on the YouTubes. I think it's got me logged into the wrong one. Maybe that's it. I don't know. Anyway, back to the topic.

Complaints Supervisors And Body Cams

SPEAKER_02 40:06

Um so what have we covered so far? We covered whether or not he should be out with the vehicle or out with the people. No. Do they have the right to film on the sidewalk? Yes. Um, was the detention legal? It didn't seem like it. Was the demand for ID legal according to Florida law? It didn't seem like it. Um, so then we get into the complaint side. Um the complaint side is is is a part of the the issue I have too. This it again, it was clipped, so we didn't see the lead up part of the lieutenant, but the lieutenant did not seem to give a shit. The lieutenant didn't seem to be, I mean, he wasn't writing anything down. Couldn't tell if he had a body cam. I wasn't paying attention that close. Did he have a body cam? That's something I would be concerned about. Um I I questions that I have is like one, why did he feel the need to put us in cuffs? What was the reason? What what can you articulate in your safety? What safety concern did you have? That that always goes into if I'm gonna put cuffs on somebody. Now, could he articulate they're bigger than him? Yeah, I think he could articulate that. They called him fake ass Danny DeVito, which I thought was funny. Uh you know, what what was his what was his argument for detention? That's another question that I would have for as a lieutenant. And what did he say? Because I wanted to. Like, I don't that doesn't work for me. Because I wanted to? You you can't Okay, so legally speaking, does he have to tell you why he's detaining you? I'm gonna ask that one to the chat. What do you guys think about that one? Does he have to tell you why he's detaining you? Legally speaking. I know the answer. At least in in my estate. Most people aren't gonna like it. But I'm just curious what you guys think in the in the chat. I'm really curious why my why my YouTube vertical is not freaking working. It's angering me. I'm testing the chat again. It does look like it's going through on everything except for YouTube. I don't get it. I'm looking over on YouTube and the chat's not moving even on the YouTube right now. So what is the issue going on over there? The last chat I see is from two minutes ago, and that was from Attack Cop. So we're troubleshooting on the live as we go. Now the good news is I do record these, and then I will be putting them up for uh our audio. But I'm also looking over on TikTok and I don't see anybody chatting over on TikTok, really. Um Rumble Ridge said it's vertical on my screen, so the vertical is working for them. That's good. Uh okay, so do you have to tell somebody why you're detaining them? No, you don't. You don't have you don't have a legal obligation to tell them. And that's kind of shitty. I I tell people if I'm detaining, yeah, you're being detained. I'm telling you why you're being detained. Um the cop policing has a lot of carte blanche when it comes to I don't even know if that's the right word, carte blanche, but they have a lot of leeway on when it comes to detaining people. They don't have To explain shit. They can just come up to you and say you're under arrest, and guess what? According to the law, you got to comply with that. It's kind of shitty, right? Chat is working on vertical, restream is just isn't catching it. Okay. Must be it. I'm just making sure the chat's working because it slowed down. There's a lot of people on. I've got, I'm showing like up to 50 people on, and the chat just kind of died. So I'm testing to see if it's because it's not coming through or if it's because of a restream. So

Accountability Standards And IA Reality

SPEAKER_02 44:33

good to know. Good to know. Okay. So um. So what should the accountability look like? That's I got some notes over here. I'm just trying to keep up with that. Um, we actually have uh the officer's explanation. Let me see here. According to the investigation coverage, Rubio later cited interference with a traffic investigation in fear of an ambush. Oh, okay. So I found I found uh some more stuff. So this is what the officer said is that he feared for an ambush and that he was on a traffic investigation. Okay. So legally speaking, if that is the truth, if that's what he claimed, I would argue that you didn't have a legitimate safety concern. Because you how do you articulate an ambush off of that? How do you articulate that that's what that's what you thought? If that were the case, why didn't you un ask the vehicle right away? If that were the case, how come you were so casual about it? How can like there's a whole bunch of things? Like it's bullshit. That's a bullshit answer. You know that. Um they were the men were reportedly held for nearly 40 minutes before release. Um internal affairs sustained improper procedure and discourtesy allegations. Reporting also saying responding supervisor was was cited for refusing to take their complaint. The article did not establish the final punishment. Shit. Well that sucks. So we don't know the outcome. We just know that there was an internal investigation. Uh yeah, we need to we need to know what what accountability would look like for that. If if it was a bullshit detention to me, fired. There's nothing else. Um Twitchy said the vert has been slow this morning. Yeah, that's crazy. Um so yeah, Rumble Ridge. Bullshit. Yeah, exactly. I agree. I think it's bullshit too. Um what would distinguish a training problem from deliberate misconduct? Uh, to me, that if he was going off the mindset of, well, I'm on a traffic investigation, so I can detain them because they're distracting me. Like I did you tell these guys that, hey, I'm on an investigation, I can't talk to you right now, go away. Did you do any of that? Like these are things that I would want to know. Um, but I will say this, it does give him, it gives him an out. If he was on a traffic investigation, it does give him an out. Legally speaking, or or internally speaking, I should say. Um I'm not sure. Oh, maybe that I think what HBO Matt's telling me is that this guy that's in this video may be deceased, maybe have overdosed or something. Um you know, now what was it's some other questions that I'd have for myself is like, what is my duties, what is my responsibilities as a supervisor? As the supervisor, I've got to like I have to be impartial. I have to discuss with this guy. And I'm gonna, I am going to try to squash any official um complaints. Like, I'm always going to try to squash any official complaints, but not at the expense of somebody. I'm just I'm always gonna try to find the the path of least resistance. Hey, let me talk to my officer, see what he says. Okay, my officer told me he kind of accounted for exactly what you said. This is where he was coming from. Um if my officer comes over here uh and and apologizes and you're good with that apology, can we can we squash it there? Um, I think I think we can own up that maybe he messed up here and he wants to have an opportunity to make that right. And a lot of I would say 99% of the time that I've done that, the people I've been out with have agreed to that. Because ultimately, I think that's just people want the respect and they want you to own up. And and that has squashed it. Do I think that's what would have happened here? Probably not. Um, but I think that that's a fair way to go about it. That's what I do as a supervisor. What is my responsibility? My responsibility is to be fair and impartial and then try to handle it at the lowest level. Um, and if that's not unless I see something illegal, let's put it that way. So on this one, there's a possibility that we had something illegal. So I'm gonna have to take that up and give that to IA and let him know this is what I found. Here's the body can't. Like I have to give everything over that I've got as evidence. My interview, the officer's um interview, or whatever, and send that up. And this is where I dislike the argument. Well, we investigated ourselves and found nothing wrong. Does that happen? Yes, but at the same time, I've seen a lot of great IA cases go through and and do their job and do what they're supposed to do. So there's that. Um just looking over, I'm looking at my notes. I'm sorry. I hate when I get dead air, but um shut how should the officer respond when somebody is clearly trying to provoke a reaction?

Not Taking The Bait

SPEAKER_02 50:49

So that's another thing. This is when it goes into some of the auditors. I don't care for it. I do I think that this guy was trying to provoke a reaction a little bit. I do think so. I think they went in asking for it, but at the same time, quit falling for the bait. I I have yet, I'm gonna keep putting this out there. If somebody can show me one, I've yet to see any of anybody that's just out there recording in a public sidewalk that has done any sort of um any sort of violence towards police. Has anybody seen that? I haven't. I'm not saying it can't happen, and I'm not saying you shouldn't be safe and keep you know reasonable distances during certain types of encounters and whatnot. I'm not saying that, but I'm saying you know, you know what these First Amendment auditors are trying to do sometimes. Don't fall for that. You should know better. This this was an ego thing to me. Um, if you're in the chat and you're like, why does he keep saying stuff in the chat? It's just because I'm testing it to see if it's working. I don't like that it's not working here on restream. Uh and and what's crazy is all of a sudden it'll start working again. Like, at least that's what happened last time. So uh, but we're coming up on an hour. Um, I might I might close this one out in an hour. Um let me let me let me end it kind of like this. You don't have to like the person holding the camera to take the right seriously. You don't have to like them to take the right seriously. Uh what I expect from the officer is clear legal basis. Like you need to have it, sound judgment. Um, the the ability to stop an encounter from becoming personal. I think that that's how we should be doing this. So tell me after I end this, tell me what you would have done differently. Please head over to our YouTube channel, like, follow, subscribe, um, bring your questions to our next live. I think uh I think we're gonna just keep doing these daily. We'll have a topic, maybe multiple topics to hit. Um HG Bud Bud over on YouTube said, frauditors wouldn't have an audience if they behave reasonable. You're not wrong. They would, they wouldn't have, they would not have an audience if the cops did their job the right way. I don't really care for the term frauditor, though. Um they should get used to being filmed by the public. 100%. They should. There's there's really no excuse for it in this day and age. You shouldn't just be saying, You, you know, are you filming me? You should say, I make sure you get the right side. Hey, my body cam's faced over this way. I just hit my mic. Make sure you get me from this angle. I need as many angles as I can get. I'm all about it. The more video, the more video for me, the better. It's just another witness showing me doing the right thing. Uh Rumble said auditors would have nothing to do if the police didn't act up. I agree. 100% agree. I'm gonna finish this last six minutes. I'm gonna make this an hour. So

Fundraiser And Closing CTAs

SPEAKER_02 54:25

we got six minutes uh just go into the chat. But I want to uh I want to make sure that you guys, ooh, our GoFundMe is up to $2,200 for Roberto. Make sure you guys hit that GoFundMe and go to any of my channels. Um YouTube, Facebook, LinkedIn, um, I think Instagram. I don't think we have it on TikTok because TikTok's harder to post like stuff for that. But make sure you find Roberto's new legs. We're trying to get Roberto some new legs. The the goal's $400,000 in two months. I've never really raised over about $1,200, so we've already kind of doubled what I've ever raised, but we're gonna get that to them. Uh you can film cops, but respect the distance and shut up and don't interfere. You can. 100%, you can. But let's not take away some of the responsibility from the cops. They shouldn't be falling for this shit. They should understand that people have a First Amendment right to film in public places. Lord knows we're trying to use that, trying to defend having LPRs. So if we're gonna try to defend LPRs with it as cops, then we need to be understanding and realize the same shit for First Amendment otters. Even Second Amendment otters, you got them out there too. I'm a big pro-2A guy, so uh Rumble says it doesn't work that way. But yeah, we we need to be, we need one, we need to get way more constitutional training. We need to get uh more constitutional units out there. Um I know Dallas PD has one. Um I really like the idea of the um the police um I think they're called I always forget the damn name of them. Oh police accountability. Let me find it real quick. Um, I think it's called the uh Office of Police Oversight Monitors. So you got police oversight monitors or office of the police oversight monitors. Um, those are good to have for departments as well. Um often referred to as opum, op. So if you never heard of those, if your department doesn't have those opum, I'm gonna type it in the chat. Umice of the police oversight monitor. Those are great units to have as well. I think they do a lot of good work. Um lost my chat all of a sudden. There it is. Um, it's not gonna type it over there, so I'm gonna put it open office of police oversight monitors. So that's another good thing to have. Uh where are we at? We got less than two and a half minutes left. Um just talking in the chat here. So getting those going, constitutional units, those are all things that we need to make sure that we're we're doing so we don't fall for this stuff. Um HG says the filming isn't the issue, it's interference that creates the confrontation. And and that can be true. Um and that tends to be the auditors I don't care for. It's one thing if you're filming, just like you said, but when you're getting up there and you're intentionally trying to provoke a reaction, like I just don't care for that. Don't care for that at all. I think that that's uh poor taste and you you're losing sight of doing of why it started to begin with. I think that the some of the guys out there, you know, you look at Jeff Gray and some of the, like, he doesn't even say anything. Just holds a sign and he gets fucked with. Like, what is the mission? And so you're you are going to see with all these demonetizations of some of these First Amendment orders, you're gonna really see where their heart truly lied, truly lied as well. Are they in it for the mission or were they in it truly just to try to monetize and make money? So that's something that we need to pay attention to and and you know, think about. Um, all right, guys. We are we're done. We got it all. Thanks again. Uh, if you're not doing it already, please. Um, one way to support us, if you want to donate to the show, we've got buy a cup of coffee. You can do that. Not not send that money to YouTube. YouTube takes a huge cut when you guys do super chats and do memberships and all that stuff. Uh, all the money goes right back into the show. If you don't add the money to do that, and that's not why we do this, um, we would love for you to just share. Hit the like button, follow, subscribe, do all that stuff. Do what all the teenage girls rave about. Like my channel. Like my channel. So appreciate you guys. Uh, we'll catch you guys on the next one. Take it easy. And to my mods. Thank you, mods. Twitchy kicked butt today. Appreciate you.